View Poll Results: Are White People an oppressed minority in America?

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  • Yes

    135 71.43%
  • No

    53 28.04%
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    1 0.53%
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Thread: Are White People an oppressed minority?

  1. #121
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    Re: Are White People an oppressed minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    have you ever applied to a college? every college/university I have ever heard of requires students to take some kind of standardized test (ACT, SAT, etc) for admission, if you don't score above a certain level YOU ARE NOT ADMITTED. if you are truely so ignorant that you think college acceptance isn't based on grades then there is no further point in even talking to you. good-bye
    To be fair, placement test scores tell much more about a particular student than their high school life. In my personal experience, i had a lower GPA but a high ACT score and tested into calc II. But none of that really mattered as i had an athletic scholarship (track).
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  2. #122
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    Re: Are White People an oppressed minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    and you don't think that gave them an advantage over non-minority applicants?
    If the goal was to get into that particular school, then yes. But i have little doubt that these applicants would have had little trouble getting into another school, hence maintaining their competitive advantage!
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  3. #123
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    Re: Are White People an oppressed minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    If the goal was to get into that particular school, then yes. But i have little doubt that these applicants would have had little trouble getting into another school, hence maintaining their competitive advantage!
    and so then, without this preferential treatment would the "minimally qualified" minorities been accepted into this school? probably not. ergo, due to the preferential treatment given, the "minimally qualified" applicants race was an advantage.
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    Re: Are White People an oppressed minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    and so then, without this preferential treatment would the "minimally qualified" minorities been accepted into this school? probably not. ergo, due to the preferential treatment given, the "minimally qualified" applicants race was an advantage.
    And if you bothered to read the paper i posted, you can see why there is such a need to help those who are disadvantaged. Without AA (which is flawed IMHO), minority acceptance would fall 10%. In the most competitive schools, grades/scores/placement is very much similar among those applicants with a chance of being accepted.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Are White People an oppressed minority?

    The main point being. A truely qualified applicant will be accepted/hired/promoted regardless of race. If you are "minimally qualified" you stand a better chance at getting hired/admitted/promoted if you are a minority due to affirmative action policies.
    The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.

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  6. #126
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    Re: Are White People an oppressed minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    The main point being. A truely qualified applicant will be accepted/hired/promoted regardless of race. If you are "minimally qualified" you stand a better chance at getting hired/admitted/promoted if you are a minority due to affirmative action policies.
    Did you read at least the abstract/conclusion of the paper i posted?
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  7. #127
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    Re: Are White People an oppressed minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    In acceptance competitive schools, essays and interviews are the norm.
    I applied to a fairly competitive set of schools for UG, and the only ones I remember even offering personal interviews were Harvard and Yale. Regardless of whether interviews are offered at the most competitive schools, my point is that they're neither universal nor are they weighted anywhere near as heavily as other factors. Essays are universal, but I'm saying that I've never heard a single admissions officer or admissions consultant say that they were anywhere near as important as grades/test scores.

    Law school isn't a perfect analogue to UG, but lawschoolnumbers has a set of charts plotting individual student gpas/lsats and whether they were accepted or rejected to various schools. Using just those two numbers (and your race), you can predict to a strong degree of certainty whether or not you will be admitted. For example, look at georgetown last year:

    LSN :: Georgetown University - Admissions Graph

    There are a few outliers, but you can plainly see the trend lines. If you're in the rightmost band, you're pretty much set, as not one person above 172/3.0 was outright rejected. If you're in the middle band, you're most likely going to be waitlisted. If you're in the left band, you're almost certainly getting rejected unless you're a URM, which is what those green dots are.

    Even without considering UG quality, UG major, socioeconomic factors, alumni relationships, extracurriculars, work experiece, or essays, you can already pretty much tell whether someone is going to be accepted or rejected to a particular law school.

    I agree that the point system was flawed, as your article states, the law school "admitted virtually every minimally qualified underrepresented minority applicant."
    I'm not posting that so much to argue that the point system was flawed as to show how a major university weighted those factors. Even without the formal point system, I'm sure that the relative weighting is the same.
    Last edited by RightinNYC; 09-30-10 at 05:55 PM.
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  8. #128
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    Re: Are White People an oppressed minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gray_Fox_86 View Post
    To be fair they make exceptions so as to add to diversity. I was accepted to a university and i was not anywhere near the ACT/SAT level they normally ADMITTED to.
    How fair is that to the kids who worked their butts off. Got great grades, played sports, got great SAT scores but an adult says sorry we have too many of your type already. Can't you see that the people adversely impacted by that decision will feel that they were discriminated against.

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    Re: Are White People an oppressed minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    How fair is that to the kids who worked their butts off. Got great grades, played sports, got great SAT scores but an adult says sorry we have too many of your type already. Can't you see that the people adversely impacted by that decision will feel that they were discriminated against.
    Well luckily for them they will never know the real reason why. They can assume why, but will never know why.

  10. #130
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    Re: Are White People an oppressed minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    I applied to a fairly competitive set of schools for UG, and the only ones I even remember offering personal interviews were Harvard and Yale. Regardless of whether interviews are offered at the most competitive schools, my point is that they're neither universal nor are they weighted anywhere near as heavily as other factors. Essays are universal, but I'm saying that I've never heard a single admissions officer or admissions consultant say that they were anywhere near as important as grades/test scores.
    You have to take into consideration the context of my statement. If both test scores and grades were the same, there are other means of evaluating potential students; e.g. placement testing, interviews, essays, work experience, community involvement, etc.... Of course grades are important; but to believe that schools simply look at race when grades/test scores are equal ignores the recruiting process.

    Even without considering UG quality, UG major, socioeconomic factors, alumni relationships, extracurricular, work experience, or essays, you can already pretty much tell whether someone is going to be accepted or rejected to a particular law school.
    LSAT's, GRE's, MCAT's, etc... are necessary for grad schools as a means of measuring the quality of an UG education. At the UG level, standardized testing is becoming less and less important.

    I'm not posting that so much to argue that the point system was flawed as to show how a major university weighted those factors. Even without the formal point system, I'm sure that the relative weighting is the same.
    While weighting is an issue, to totally dissolve such a system would have a negative impact on diversity. International recruitment for UG would probably increase as a result (IMO).
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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