View Poll Results: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

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  • Yes, they should be paid more each year they teach.

    4 8.33%
  • No (please explain how you think they should be paid)

    44 91.67%
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Thread: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

  1. #231
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    Re: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    One very glaring error in your philosophy....actually 2.....
    We don't RECEIVE an education, we take it. When teachers teach 30 kids in one classroom, and some do well, and some do not, it is NOT the teachers fault. He/She puts the information out, but SOME kids are listening, and others or not....
    And taxes? Taxes have been low for a decade or so, at least, thanks to Bush. Even letting the Bush tax cuts expire, taxes will still be lower than when I went to public schools.

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  2. #232
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    Re: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    Private schools cannot pick and choose students. They have to accept everyone if their parents can pay for it. It's against the law in every state to allow private schools to pick and choose. As far as excluding students, public schools do it all the time. It's called expulsion.
    No, it is common for private schools to refuse students, in most states. And they filter out kids in many ways. One is testing to get in, another is the high tuition which is not tax deductible. Now, church schools may be more flexible, but then you have to put up with "intelligent design" and/or creationism.
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  3. #233
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    Re: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    It's actually quite easy to be expelled from school. Bring a toy gun to school and we'll see how long you'll be able to attend. Ask too many questions and you will be expelled for causing trouble.
    and what kind of questions are you referring to?
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  4. #234
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    Re: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    What about the schools in New York City where children as young as 5 are arrested for failing to listen to the teachers? What about schools that lose accredidation from the state? Should they still be allowed to teach when they have demonstrated that they cannot?
    arrested? you are making that up....
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  5. #235
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    Re: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

    In Finland the public education system employs Masters Degree level education for teachers... Guess who has the most effective education system in the world? Teachers level of education should be the primary determining factor on their pay.. of course they deserve raises just like anyone else in the job market.

  6. #236
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    Re: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    We don't RECEIVE an education, we take it. When teachers teach 30 kids in one classroom, and some do well, and some do not, it is NOT the teachers fault. He/She puts the information out, but SOME kids are listening, and others or not....
    A good teacher can certainly change the proportion of those who are listening. Of course kids are going to be falling asleep in class if the teacher drones on in a monotone voice, spending the entire class facing the whiteboard with his back to his students. Furthermore, a good teacher can change how much the good students excel, and how far behind the bad students fall. There will always be some students who do better than others, but the teacher absolutely does have an effect on how much they are learning. It's about much more than student involvement, and in any case, student involvement is not a constant. If it was, we could just replace all the teachers with a recording of the lesson and save a lot of money on salaries.

    Research has shown that a good teacher can cover 1.5 years of material in a single school year, whereas a bad teacher may cover as little as 0.5 years. In other words, the quality of the teacher determines an entire year's worth of material each and every school year.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 10-06-10 at 12:20 PM.
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  7. #237
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    Re: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    And to Justabubba ( I just knew some would fail to understand my comment about potentially paying a teacher who fails students more): The bit about failing relates to the above quote too. It's not about failing students to fail them. DOH! It's about holding kids back who haven't shown the skills to move to the next grade... and dragging those students down.

    Instead of pushing illiterates along, failing a kid has an effect. On him and others. They get the message they are expected to succeed before moving on. It puts pressures on the kid to learn. It's a clear message. You can't just show up and expect to be moved along. If they don't care... then they can sit in the third grade for two or three years. Or take summer school to catch up. Believe me, they'll care. If not, we always need people to pick fruit and vegetables.

    And Utah: Competition does work. If a school wants the finest teachers and pays them according to negotiations with the teacher (not some union scale), standards are elevated. Parents will notice. All boats will rise.

    .
    I agree that we should make failing kids repeat grades....but parents have a say in that.
    My wife didn't compete, didn't have to, she just did a good job, and the other 2 K teachers looked bad in comparison, very bad.
    The principal tried to fire her for not "following the curriculum" when she in fact had done exactly what was required, she just didn't quit after that. She didn't go slow, she had a years worth of work done in less than half a year. Kindergarten in Idaho was too easy, the requirements were the kind of thing that most 4 year old kids can do...
    But, given a choice, getting the kids to compete is far more effective than getting teachers to compete...
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  8. #238
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    Re: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    A good teacher can certainly change the proportion of those who are listening. Of course kids are going to be falling asleep in class if the teacher drones on in a monotone voice, spending the entire class facing the whiteboard with his back to his students. Furthermore, a good teacher can change how much the good students excel, and how far behind the bad students fall. There will always be some students who do better than others, but the teacher absolutely does have an effect on how much they are learning. It's about much more than student involvement, and in any case, student involvement is not a constant. If it was, we could just replace all the teachers with a recording of the lesson and save a lot of money on salaries.

    Research has shown that a good teacher can cover 1.5 years of material in a single school year, whereas a bad teacher may cover as little as 0.5 years. In other words, the quality of the teacher determines an entire year's worth of material each and every school year.
    I never said that good teachers aren't part of the solution. They just are not the only part...
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  9. #239
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    Re: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    arrested? you are making that up....
    I wish I was. There was a story about 5 years ago on Yahoo about a 5 year old student in New York City that was arrested for jumping into a puddle while standing in line to go back inside. I can't find a link to it, but I do remember reading about it.

  10. #240
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    Re: Should teachers be paid purely based on years of experience?

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    I never said that good teachers aren't part of the solution. They just are not the only part...
    True, but they are a larger factor than anything else over which the school has control.
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