View Poll Results: Tax cuts cost nothing and are free

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115. You may not vote on this poll
  • No way.

    47 40.87%
  • Yes, they are free

    68 59.13%
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Thread: Tax cuts are free

  1. #51
    Sage

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    Re: Tax cuts are free

    Of course they are not "free".
    If our taxes, right now, are fair and equitable, and nothing is done to change anything, then this non-action is free.
    Where I disagree with the conservatives is the concept of using tax cuts to stimulate our economy. This may work in the short term, but not in the long term.
    What we should do are the things necessary for full employment.

  2. #52
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    Re: Tax cuts are free

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    it depends on the particular cut, and it depends upon your horizon.
    Fair enough. I'm sure we could find some particular tax cut that effectively over a reasonable period of time was free. But that isn't income tax rates at reasonable levels.

    for example if you were to slash income taxes from 35% to 15%, it is unlikely that within the next two years income in the US would rise by an order enough to make up the difference; but if you were to offer a one-year capital gains tax cut of (say) from 20 to 15%, then it is possible that enough people would seek to make good on that cut by realizing their gains that you would see an increase in total revenues.
    Maybe. The problem with that argument is that people would likely front load all of their gain taking into one year at low rates rather then spread out regular gain taking. It's hard to say that it would actually increase revenues. Say if people took $50 billion in gains in the 15% rather then take $50 billion over time at 20%, that's less. Much depends on the market at the time rather then the tax rate.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  3. #53
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    Re: Tax cuts are free

    lol. Nice going there turtledude. Logging out of the system and voting repetitively as a guest. Actual real users who voted "free" are at the moment 3. The rest are guest voters. Honesty is clearly not a trait you hold.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  4. #54
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Tax cuts are free

    Quote Originally Posted by Teh Internets View Post
    Yes trading a tax cut for other spending is a cost. If you cut back spending to avoid losing revenue that does not make tax cuts free.
    wrong again-you assume that other spending necessary. If you continue to spend on that its that activity that costs money, not the lack of revenue to pay for it



  5. #55
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Tax cuts are free

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    lol. Nice going there turtledude. Logging out of the system and voting repetitively as a guest. Actual real users who voted "free" are at the moment 3. The rest are guest voters. Honesty is clearly not a trait you hold.
    Prove it or apologize. I have been away from my house from 8.30 this morning to 10 minutes ago. YOu make accusations you cannot possibly prove



  6. #56
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Tax cuts are free

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm View Post
    Of course they are not "free".
    If our taxes, right now, are fair and equitable, and nothing is done to change anything, then this non-action is free.
    Where I disagree with the conservatives is the concept of using tax cuts to stimulate our economy. This may work in the short term, but not in the long term.
    What we should do are the things necessary for full employment.
    fair and equitable? an opinion of someone who doesn't pay much taxes

    those of us who do say the tax structure is blatantly unfair to those who shoulder too much of the load



  7. #57
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Tax cuts are free

    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel View Post
    It isn't just turtledude that is complete denial of all this. It's like arguing with a brick wall. Cutting off a source of revenue costs money. The tiny percentage of employers in that top percentile who will pay more taxes have zero effect on the tax base. The tax cuts do not pay for themselves. Further the assumption is that while this minuscule group will not try and expand or employ more people because they pay a small portion of their wealth in taxes is poor logic at best.

    I can see value in continuation of middleclass tax cuts somewhat. Obviously a couple thousand dollars in working class peoples pockets makes a difference in their ability to consume. I don't believe tax cuts are an appropriate way to go about stimulus personally but letting the Bush Tax cuts expire on the middle class in a time of recession isn't a good idea. Sometime in the future after the economy recovers taxation will have to come back. Deficit spending can be dealt with in good times .. not in bad times.

    Arguments with turtledude usually end up in some variety of elitist insinuation where by all the unfortunate people deserve what they get and all the wealthy are victims of the parasitic state. What he does not acknowledge is the parasitic nature of the wealthy on society. Clearly if there is a "tapeworm" on American society you can find it on wall street financials and the banking industry.. not main street.
    your definition of cost is faulty. If you have no money that doesn't mean you have costs. Its only if you spend do you have costs



  8. #58
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    Re: Tax cuts are free

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Prove it or apologize. I have been away from my house from 8.30 this morning to 10 minutes ago. YOu make accusations you cannot possibly prove
    Prove it. Tell me, why is that virtually ALL of the "Free" votes are guest votes while most of the "no way" votes are actual, registered users?

    17 out of 22 "no" votes are registered users.
    2 out of 24 "free" votes are registered users.

    So really counting actual users, Not Free is 89% and Free is 11%.
    Last edited by obvious Child; 09-19-10 at 07:00 PM.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  9. #59
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    Re: Tax cuts are free

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    your definition of cost is faulty. If you have no money that doesn't mean you have costs. Its only if you spend do you have costs
    No, that would be your definition. You have constantly avoided my analogy proving that the forgone revenue results in a cost. Pretending peoples' posts who refute you don't exist does not show that your argument is strong.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  10. #60
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Tax cuts are free

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Prove it. Tell me, why is that virtually ALL of the "Free" votes are guest votes while most of the "no way" votes are actual, registered users?
    I tire of your lies about me. Stop your silly accusations that you cannot prove. Your moronic poll is just that and I didn't vote in it. I am sure that the mods here have the ability to trace the IP addresses of those who voted and I am sure If I were lying one of them would be more than happy to point it out.



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