View Poll Results: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

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  • Politician

    12 19.05%
  • Businessman

    51 80.95%
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Thread: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

  1. #71
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    Re: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

    Quote Originally Posted by ElijahGalt View Post
    And which idea is that? The idea to live and let live is a good idea. I'm not sure a politician created that one.
    What about something like the TVA? That produced jobs and electricity that have overall been a huge public boon. Or the freeways we drive on. These things are tremendously helpful to everyone, and would likely not have happened without the government.
    The Makeout Hobo is real, and does indeed travel around the country in his van and make out with ladies... If you meet the Makeout Hobo, it is customary to greet him with a shot of whiskey and a high five (if you are a dude) or passionate makeouts (if you are a lady).

  2. #72
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    Re: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Good politicians are good

    Bad Politicians are bad

    Good Businessmen are good

    Bad Businessmen are bad

    Good politician vs. Bad Businessmen = Good politician

    Good businessmen vs. Good politician = Good Businessmen

    Next class we'll teach you how not ask questions that can't be answered in a black and white fashion.
    I hope you're not he teacher.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  3. #73
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    Re: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

    Quote Originally Posted by the makeout hobo View Post
    What would stop me from coming over with a group of my friends, after you've already cooked up the steaks, and forcibly taking them? Nothing. There may be no governmental planning, but without governmental protection you'd be a lot less secure.
    As I said, I'm not an anarchist, but I do understand temporary autonomous zones. I'm a libertarian, which means I believe government should be strictly limited to protecting our fundamental rights (not materialistic rights - ie universal health care, paid vacations, etc) and should protect our liberties from the obstructive acts of other individuals or institutions. Therefore, it follows, I do not believe in privatizing the military or the police force.

    Just to argue devil's advocate, the major reason why you wouldn't come over with a group of your friends to steal my steaks is because (in a world of anarchy) I might possibly be armed to the teeth and you could very well die. So I guess, when you boil it down, government DOES NOT create morality through legislation. You would not do such a thing because you want to live FIRST and the steaks are not worth a painful death. You would refrain from committing harmful acts against other human beings because of the possible repercussions. Because other human beings are just like you. They just want to live life without annoyance. Those who kill, rape, and molest have little regard to human life and therefore exhibit no decency in the presence or absence of law.

  4. #74
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    Re: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Nice strawman. you make it seem like I don't realize that society does this, when all I said is that I would need more detail to make the determination.

    I don't admire a certain occupation over another, especially not the one's being discussed. I judge people on their character.



    Robbing a liquor store to feed your family when no other option exists? Yeah, I admire a person willing to do that in those situations.



    Like I said, I need more details before I can make the determination of which one is more admirable. Most politicans AND businessmen I've met in my life were douchebags.
    This is quite a strawman argument. Only, you're putting up the strawman and I'm bored enough to break it down. Here's an easy way to find out if you admire an occupation (I, of course, honor human beings before intangible occupations...but this thread is specifically about occupations):

    Are you employed? Have you EVER, in your entire life, wished or fantasized about working in some particular field for a living ("What do you do for a living?" haveis often a question about one's own occupation)? If the answer is yes to either one of these questions, then you have, in fact, admired certain occupational positions throughout your life. This wasn't meant to be as deep as, "Who has been your favorite human being(s) in life?" This is more like, "What career would you choose if you had these two choices?"

  5. #75
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    Re: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    However, as I am quite sure you would acknowledge, greed on the part of the businessman could have dire consequences towards the commonwealth if allowed. You prefer the grower of products, the direct contributor of the economy, providing for himself and for others. I do not deny such audacity, such risk, and such glorious rewards. On the other hand, I merely admire more those who are tasked to make the society orderly and lawful.
    Like I've stated before, I support a limited government that will protect the fundamental rights of human beings to live free and just lives. Thomas Jefferson once said, "If it doesn't break my leg or pick from my pocket, I'm fine with it." If the businessman's greed is so vile that he's actually committing fraud and abuse, then he should be absolutely punished by society. If, however, a young couple buys a home with a ridiculous, interest-only loan (it happens all the time) without reading the contract first, then it is not my responsibility to pay for their mistake or to pay for some inefficient oversight commission that will do little to prevent ignorance from happening. Any student of regulatory capture understands the dire consequences of governmental interference.

    And who makes society orderly and lawful? Mussolini made the trains run on time. Is that order? And who creates the criminals? The more LAWS you create, the more CRIMINALS you create.

  6. #76
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    Re: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

    Quote Originally Posted by the makeout hobo View Post
    What about something like the TVA? That produced jobs and electricity that have overall been a huge public boon. Or the freeways we drive on. These things are tremendously helpful to everyone, and would likely not have happened without the government.
    If the TVA and public transportation are your best examples, then you don't have much (in comparison to the private sector). The TVA's fiscal liability costs more than the most expensive floods in the valley, and the waterway they built is used primarily to ship coal to the TVA's electricity generating steam plants. The TVA model has also completely failed in the global south.

    Please also don't forget how the roads started. The sole reason was to increase mobility for military personnel and equipment, and that is a good security reason. The traffic on these roads is stressful for all of us, and "free things" being used by everybody will cause delays no matter what. I'm not particularily against roads and buses, for these are fairly cheap governmental expenditures. I'm more concerned about the ridiculous rail idea, a financial money pit that will help to bankrupt the country.

    I'm just criticizing your two suggestions. I feel I shouldn't have to go on about the economic wonders that occur when you let individuals drive their own lives.

  7. #77
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    Re: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

    Quote Originally Posted by ElijahGalt View Post
    Who is underpaid?
    The American working man, of which I was one.
    This statement sounds good, if not totally true. But, I have read that the wages and benefits have been stagnant for the past 30 years..
    During this time, the Mexicans and Chinese have been playing "catch-up".

  8. #78
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    Re: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    Where would the man work without the businessman to provide the job?
    How would the businessman stay in business without the working man to do all the things that need to get done for the business to stay in operation?

  9. #79
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    Re: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm View Post
    The American working man, of which I was one.
    This statement sounds good, if not totally true. But, I have read that the wages and benefits have been stagnant for the past 30 years..
    During this time, the Mexicans and Chinese have been playing "catch-up".
    If you were underpaid, why didn't you seek alternative employment that earned you more money?

    If you did seek alternative employment that paid more, and you did not find it, that means the market was paying you what you were worth.

    Ergo, you were not underpaid.

  10. #80
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    Re: Who is more ADMIRABLE, the POLITICIAN or the BUSINESSMAN?

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm View Post
    The American working man, of which I was one.
    This statement sounds good, if not totally true. But, I have read that the wages and benefits have been stagnant for the past 30 years..
    During this time, the Mexicans and Chinese have been playing "catch-up".
    The best way to measure the economic growth of the middle class is to define the amount of time it takes for the average to obtain various materials. How many hours of labor did it take the average working man or woman to obtain a cell phone? Only the rich could afford them in the 1980s, and now even the most poorest of souls have service. How many poor souls had air-conditioning and heating in their homes just twenty years ago? How many had Internet? How many have connection today? How many hours of labor did it take to obtain an item is a far more pragmatic measuring system.

    If you are underpaid, then go somewhere where the market demands your services. The market dictates prices, based on the conscious decisions of multi-billions of people. If your labor is only worth so much, then get a new skill or go somewhere they'll pay you more. No one sulking in his or her own misery ever achieved success.

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