View Poll Results: (Fill in the blank) People should pay more for health insurance if they _________.

Voters
39. You may not vote on this poll
  • smoke

    28 71.79%
  • are overweight

    19 48.72%
  • are underweight

    8 20.51%
  • don't exercise on a normal basis or aren't active

    10 25.64%
  • don't eat a balanced diet

    9 23.08%
  • have a previous medical condition

    12 30.77%
  • have a family history of a medical condition

    6 15.38%
  • are older

    16 41.03%
  • can afford it

    3 7.69%
  • Other (explain)

    10 25.64%
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Thread: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

  1. #71
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    Re: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    -you place no value in actuarial tables, even though they are as close to perfect as one can be in predicting risks across demographics and time
    Incorrect sir. I'm quite certain, in fact, that actuarial tables are great for what they are INTENDED for: Predicting risks and calculating premiums accordingly, within the bounds of the law. They are completely irrelevant to the question I was addressing: Whether government should ALLOW insurers to charge anyone whatever the actuarial tables indicate, regardless of whether or not the person has any control over their risk factors. There are numerous policy reasons why that's a bad idea.

    Again, you seem to have missed my point entirely. I have NEVER argued that old and young people are equal risks to health insurers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman
    -you operate under thge false assumption that charging dfferent premiums for different risks somehow elimiates the aggregating effect of the insurance pool as a whole.
    It doesn't completely ELIMINATE it, but it certainly lessens it.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 08-18-10 at 01:38 PM.
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  2. #72
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    Re: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    You -tried- to dispute it. Why?
    Can you please point me to where I said that young people and old people are equally likely to be huge cost drains on insurers? I didn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman
    You plan to convince young people that it is a good idea by simply forcing it on them?
    Good luck wit that.
    I don't need luck, it's already the law. A health insurance mandate goes into effect in 2014, whether you like it or not.
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  3. #73
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    Re: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    If that were the case and the insurance companies could only charge one price for a given level of coverage, they will increase the premiums for young/healthy people to make up for the loss of premiums for the old/sick people.

    You'll be OK with that?
    How do you sell that to the young/healthy people?
    Selling things can be too difficult.
    A GOOD salesman is most important. Any fool, even I, can sell water to a thirsty man in the desert.
    But to sell a clean/plentiful water supply to those who need it can be impossible...
    Rather than "selling" health insurance, just make it the law of our land.

  4. #74
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Incorrect sir. I'm quite certain, in fact, that actuarial tables are great for what they are INTENDED for: Predicting risks and calculating premiums accordingly, within the bounds of the law.
    So you agree that the insueance companies, through actuarial science, accurately calculate risk and adjust premiums accordingly.

    They are completely irrelevant to the question I was addressing: Whether government should ALLOW insurers to charge anyone whatever the actuarial tables indicate, regardless of whether or not the person has any control over their risk factors. There are numerous policy reasons why that's a bad idea.
    Just as there are numerous policy (among others) reasons why it is a bad idea to force the young and healthy to subsidize the health care costs of the old and sick, especially when the old and sick have conditions and afflictions related to their lifestyle choices.

    It doesn't completely ELIMINATE it..
    Then your point to that effect is countered. Thank you.

  5. #75
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    Re: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

    Do lLike the Swiss do. Insurance is mandatory, the Government annually negotiates the rate for essential cover with the insurance companies. No company can refuse cover, and the insured never has to pay more than 8% of salary. The companies can sell extra levels of cover at market rates.
    Don't work out, work in.

    Never eat anything that's served in a bucket.

  6. #76
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Can you please point me to where I said that young people and old people are equally likely to be huge cost drains on insurers? I didn't.
    Dont be dishonest now - I said that for mos people, most health care costs are incurred in the last 20 years of their lives.
    You tried to duspue that.

    I don't need luck, it's already the law. A health insurance mandate goes into effect in 2014, whether you like it or not.
    ROTFL
    So you -arent- going to try to convince anyne that your idea has merit -- you're just going to use force to make people comply with it.
    Isn't freedom grand?

    AND... you didnt address the question I asked. I asked you how you planned to convince young healthy people that they should subsidize the costs of the old and sick.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 08-18-10 at 01:54 PM.

  7. #77
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    Re: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    The guy with the speeding tickets CHOSE to drive recklessly. No one chooses to get leukemia.

    Regarding the other variables that you mentioned (the age and gender of the applicant, and the type of car), ideally that wouldn't play a factor for auto insurance. For what it's worth, it's NOT fair that insurers would assume that someone is more of a risk based solely on their demographics rather than their actions. However, it's simply not that big of a deal since auto insurance costs are considerably lower and less important than health insurance costs. It just isn't worth the hassle of regulating auto insurance more heavily.
    nobody chooses to get in an accident either. But they do choose their lifestyle choices just as they do choose the speed they drive. And they both have consequences that are costly. So why should anybody but them have to pay for these choices?

  8. #78
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    Re: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

    Oh my!



    The strawmen are taking a terrible beating on this thread, aren't they?


    OH, THE INHUMANITY!


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    Re: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

    For clarification: We're talking about how private companies charge for their services. Their payment structures should be entirely up to them and the participation in these plans should be 100% voluntary. Health insurance is nothing but a business agreement - a service offered by private corporations that may or may not be worth it to you. The only thing that should be mandated is full disclosure (including making sure that the policies are clear). I really just don't understand how we can debate whether or not it should be 1) forced upon each individual and 2) regulated to the degree that the companies are told how much and for what reasons they are allowed to charge their customers.

    This whole health insurance debate really just doesn't make sense to me. I've heard a lot of arguments in favor of the legislation. And I truly am trying to understand. But I just don't. Private company offering a service that you choose to take or you don't. Why did the government step in?

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    Re: When should health insurance cost more for someone?

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertz View Post
    This whole health insurance debate really just doesn't make sense to me. I've heard a lot of arguments in favor of the legislation. And I truly am trying to understand. But I just don't. Private company offering a service that you choose to take or you don't. Why did the government step in?
    Bottom line?
    Some people think it is unfair for people to make emoney off of other people being sick.

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