View Poll Results: Do you agree with John Stossel?

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  • I Agree with John Stossel, this part of the Civil Rights Act Should Be Repealed

    35 50.72%
  • Absolutely NOT!!!!

    30 43.48%
  • I Don't Know

    4 5.80%
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Thread: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights Act

  1. #31
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    Re: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights A

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    The Neo-Nazi you can discriminate against. But not the lesbian. Ha! I don't agree with you, but that's why DP is so interesting.
    Why discriminate against either? If I'm selling a product and you got enough cold hard cash, I don't care who or what you are. Just shut up and pay me.

    And let me ask you this. Let's say this portion of the Civil Rights act is repealed. If a resturant were to open up near you and it hung a "No Blacks" sign in its window, would you go there? Would anyone you know go there? Of all the people I've know or have known, I can only think of a handful. Mostly from my dad's family down south who are 60+ and even in their case it would be more out of indifference than active support for racist policies. Then I can think of one or two people who I heard make openly racist statements at one time or another. Other than that, I don't think anyone I know would even consider going into such an establishment.
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    Re: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights A

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    If I understand your question, you're asking, "What other reason could a business refuse service to someone other than racism?" If that's your question, I would say that a restaurant could refuse service to anyone who was stereotyped as being a bad tipper, for example. Guess who fits that stereotype.
    Last I checked people of all races and backgrounds are capable of being bad tippers.

    If a SPECIFIC PERSON is a bad tipper, then yes I believe businesses should be able to deny service to that person.

  3. #33
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    Re: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights A

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    To HarryG, too...

    My personal feelings didn't enter into it. The way to get in a client's face when they come out with something like that is to make a really big impression. Saying what I said did that. I'm not trying to make a moral statement. I'm in business to make money. I wanted -- and got -- the client's listing with the clear understanding that there would be absolutey no racial discimination in the sale of his home. The second incident? I did it because I didn't want to get sued by HUD. That's the only power I had over the client, after all. Telling him, "Awwww, that's just not right," would get me thrown out of his house.

    Without Civil Rights laws, certainly in the area of real estate, our country would quickly revert to a segregated mess.

    Now, if my personal feelings are of interest to you, I do not consider myself prejudiced.
    The point I'm getting at is that the vast majority of people avoid discriminating not because they're threatened with jail, but because they simply don't approve of discrimination. If you had a racist colleague who refused to sell to blacks or encouraged people to back out of transactions with black purchasers, he would go out of business almost immediately due to the fact that he'd be losing business left and right. Like you said, you're in business to make money. Anyone who would willingly turn down thousands of dollars in commission just to prevent a black family from buying a house in some other neighborhood probably isn't going to last long.

    And as was mentioned earlier, our country is already segregated to a massive degree, regardless of what the Civil Rights Act says.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

  4. #34
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    Re: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights A

    Mommy, why do black people hardly ever vote for Republicans?

  5. #35
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    Re: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights A

    Quote Originally Posted by Psychoclown View Post
    Why discriminate against either? If I'm selling a product and you got enough cold hard cash, I don't care who or what you are. Just shut up and pay me.

    And let me ask you this. Let's say this portion of the Civil Rights act is repealed. If a resturant were to open up near you and it hung a "No Blacks" sign in its window, would you go there? Would anyone you know go there? Of all the people I've know or have known, I can only think of a handful. Mostly from my dad's family down south who are 60+ and even in their case it would be more out of indifference than active support for racist policies. Then I can think of one or two people who I heard make openly racist statements at one time or another. Other than that, I don't think anyone I know would even consider going into such an establishment.
    I totally agree with you. I think people who do that are nutz. Nobody would put a sign like that in their windows. But my instincts tell me that, given no consequence, some restaurants would indeed discriminate loud and clear. "I'm sorry, there's a 2-hour wait." Honestly, I could even see restaurants turning into private clubs...not that much of a stretch...membership fee waived for some; not for others. The prejudiced people I ran into in my business were more often than not in the 40's-50's and over. You could be rght that it's going of the way of the dinosaur, but I don't think it's there yet. Imagine! If it's like that in Maggie's world in Chicago, what must it be like in the south?
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  6. #36
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    Re: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights A

    Quote Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
    Mommy, why do black people hardly ever vote for Republicans?
    They are led to believe that laws actually protect people.

    Crazy I know, laws are only words on paper.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  7. #37
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    Re: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights A

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    The point I'm getting at is that the vast majority of people avoid discriminating not because they're threatened with jail, but because they simply don't approve of discrimination. If you had a racist colleague who refused to sell to blacks or encouraged people to back out of transactions with black purchasers, he would go out of business almost immediately due to the fact that he'd be losing business left and right. Like you said, you're in business to make money. Anyone who would willingly turn down thousands of dollars in commission just to prevent a black family from buying a house in some other neighborhood probably isn't going to last long.
    Real estate may be th wrong analogy for you to use. No one in the collar suburbs of Chicago is going to go out of business because they don't want to sell to blacks. And it isn't the agents, believe me. It's the sellers. The agents are scared to death of any appearance of steering or block-busting or racial discrimination. We just have to find a way to deal with those who are discriminating against them.

    And as was mentioned earlier, our country is already segregated to a massive degree, regardless of what the Civil Rights Act says.
    I absolutely agree with you. Legislation will only accomplish so much. If it's, as you say, segregated NOW, what would it be like without the Civil Acts and Fair Housing legislation?
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

  8. #38
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    Re: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights A

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I totally agree with you. I think people who do that are nutz. Nobody would put a sign like that in their windows. But my instincts tell me that, given no consequence, some restaurants would indeed discriminate loud and clear. "I'm sorry, there's a 2-hour wait." Honestly, I could even see restaurants turning into private clubs...not that much of a stretch...membership fee waived for some; not for others. The prejudiced people I ran into in my business were more often than not in the 40's-50's and over. You could be rght that it's going of the way of the dinosaur, but I don't think it's there yet. Imagine! If it's like that in Maggie's world in Chicago, what must it be like in the south?
    This of course assumes that the south's racism is more invidious that that of the north.

    I absolutely agree with you. Legislation will only accomplish so much. If it's, as you say, segregated NOW, what would it be like without the Civil Acts and Fair Housing legislation?
    Again, this assumes that the de facto segregation would be substantially worse if not for the FHA. While it would certainly have an impact at the margins, I believe that the vast, vast majority of the de facto segregation in this country exists not because of overt racism, but because of economic disparities and social self-selection. Neither one of those things is affected by the FHA.
    Last edited by RightinNYC; 08-12-10 at 08:56 PM.
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  9. #39
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    Re: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights A

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    This of course assumes that the south's racism is more invidious that that of the north.
    You should have winked after that.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

  10. #40
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    Re: John Stossel called for repeal of public accommodations section of Civil Rights A

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    You should have winked after that.
    I'm being 100% serious - I grew up in a largely white rural town in upstate NY and I never once saw anything approaching the level of casual racism and pervasive racial tension that you see in NYC. Friends from all over the south say the same thing.

    There have been five large race riots in the last 20 years:

    LA
    Seattle
    Oakland
    NYC
    Cincinnati

    Not a southern city among them.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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