View Poll Results: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

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  • No

    177 55.31%
  • Yes. please explain.

    143 44.69%
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Thread: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

  1. #1051
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener View Post
    I just wanted to mention here that the definition of marriage is now up for grabs at ebay.

    Better get your stealth bidding programs up to snuff, because this one is going down to the wire.
    Thats a fake. I got it at wallmart. Here's the receipt

    Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)-5639277711_aac21b0e02_z-copy-jpg

  2. #1052
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    1.)Thing is that equal rights require equal entities. Boys and girls are different.
    2.) Why is marriage a right? I really do not see any reason for that.
    3.) 1.200 rights etc?
    4.) They all cost something. So we have to cut them all. Then I don't really care.
    5.) But why should I pay for someones sexual dreams?
    6.) Christian beliefs are relatively well defined. But maybe you can demonstrate some esoteric christian church that likes gay marriage? I would honestly like to read the link.
    7.) Really?
    1.) wow really? so women and minorities should have equal rights by this completely failed logic. SOrry thats not how it works at all, i cant even believe you said that and thought thats true.
    2.) your approval doesnt really matter, id say the 14 times it was declared a right by SCOTUS they must of felt this freedom was important.
    3.) yes federally theres approx 1200 rights/protections
    4.) this make no sense at all, cant cut them
    5.) you factually are not, sexual dreams has nothign to do with a marriage contract.
    6.) and yet millions of chrisitians are ok with equal rights for gays and many churches have chosen not to discriminate. But like i said meaningless to the debate. NOBODY said they have to "like it" nice failed strawman though.
    7.) yes really there is factually nothing "low" about it because your premise was false.
    Quote Originally Posted by RamFel View Post
    Genetically human & human being is exactly the same thing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    homosexuality is objectively wrong, but because science tells me it is, not politics.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    I'm not at risk for AIDS. Gays are.
    Quote Originally Posted by ajn678 View Post
    there is no such thing as an abortion on a dead fetus.

  3. #1053
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Thats a fake. I got it at wallmart. Here's the receipt

    Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)-5639277711_aac21b0e02_z-copy-jpg
    Sorry for taking so long to respond. I got as far as "nipple" and my mind started to wander.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

  4. #1054
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) wow really? so women and minorities should have equal rights by this completely failed logic. SOrry thats not how it works at all, i cant even believe you said that and thought thats true.
    2.) your approval doesnt really matter, id say the 14 times it was declared a right by SCOTUS they must of felt this freedom was important.
    3.) yes federally theres approx 1200 rights/protections
    4.) this make no sense at all, cant cut them
    5.) you factually are not, sexual dreams has nothign to do with a marriage contract.
    6.) and yet millions of chrisitians are ok with equal rights for gays and many churches have chosen not to discriminate. But like i said meaningless to the debate. NOBODY said they have to "like it" nice failed strawman though.
    7.) yes really there is factually nothing "low" about it because your premise was false.
    By the way, one head of a Christian church seems to have said priests performing gay marriages are committing ultimate sin. I imagine that is because gay marriage is Unchristian?

  5. #1055
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    By the way, one head of a Christian church seems to have said priests performing gay marriages are committing ultimate sin. I imagine that is because gay marriage is Unchristian?
    again what does this have to do with anything? oh thats right nothing since religion factually has nothgin to do with legal marriage.
    Quote Originally Posted by RamFel View Post
    Genetically human & human being is exactly the same thing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    homosexuality is objectively wrong, but because science tells me it is, not politics.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    I'm not at risk for AIDS. Gays are.
    Quote Originally Posted by ajn678 View Post
    there is no such thing as an abortion on a dead fetus.

  6. #1056
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    Of course they don't own the meaning. But the word had a meaning, when the original laws were written. If the meaning is changed, the laws need to be adapted. That is fine.

    As it is probably out dated to have taxes and subsidies granted to married couples in any event, maybe we should just have everyone stand on his own. One person, one tax, one social security etc.
    Meanings of words change with time, particularly in the subtle way that this one is.

    And right now, despite popular belief, there is, overall, very little tax advantage to being married. It all depends on the couple. Almost as many people pay more in taxes married than they would if they were single. This has been proven. All the married tax filing does is make it easier for everyone so that two people who own the some of the same stuff, such as land, a house/houses, and/or cars can file for this without figuring out who owns what percentage of that. The things like tax credits or other such tax parts are doubled because there are two people. It is merely doubled. In the past, it wasn't even doubled. Married people were getting gypped because they were being treated as one tax entity even if both people were working and earning money, which put them in a higher tax bracket simply because of their marriage. In fact, even now that can happen and harm couples due solely to each would be in a lower tax bracket without their marriage but their marriage puts them in such a higher bracket that they end up paying more from that higher bracket than they would from the lower ones combined. Other people it works out for them to benefit them.

    The Congressional Budget Committee has already studied this and determined that the "benefit" of marriage to individuals is insignificant compared to many other things that give tax payers benefits.

    Plus, marriage is a benefit to society, and that accounts easily for any benefits that are seen by married couples compared to single individuals. This too has evidence to back it up. And it has nothing to do with whether or not the couple has children. That is simply another way being married benefits society, by showing that two individuals in a committed relationship are raising those children. But there is also the benefit of more money being spent, the fact that married people are proven to be more stable overall than single people, there is someone there for an adult to turn to first before they need to rely on the government/society for help should they fall on hard times, and many more. We give tax advantages for things that benefit society, including making homes much more energy efficient, giving to charity, and going to college, among just a few.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  7. #1057
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    By the way, one head of a Christian church seems to have said priests performing gay marriages are committing ultimate sin. I imagine that is because gay marriage is Unchristian?
    Who cares? Many Muslim leaders believe that educating women is committing major sins against God. Their beliefs should be no more a part of our government than Christian beliefs.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  8. #1058
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    Thing is that equal rights require equal entities. Boys and girls are different.
    Why is marriage a right? I really do not see any reason for that.
    1.200 rights etc? They all cost something. So we have to cut them all. Then I don't really care. But why should I pay for someones sexual dreams?
    Christian beliefs are relatively well defined. But maybe you can demonstrate some esoteric christian church that likes gay marriage? I would honestly like to read the link.
    Really?
    Legally, in everything that matters within legal marriage, men and women are treated the same. Spouses can be easily changed with each other within legal marriage or even personal marriages, since personal marriage is whatever each couple/group makes of it.

    Marriage is a right because it is not the government's or society's place to tell people that they can't decide who they want to be with and who they want to be part of their family or who they want to make decisions for them or to get all the benefits of marriage just because of race or sex/gender.

    Most benefits of marriage do not cost society anything, but do in fact benefit society a great deal. As long as there is any marriage, you are paying for something within that marriage. Heck, at this very moment you are helping to pay for my medical insurance and for my housing because of my legal marriage.

    If Christian beliefs were so "well defined", there would not be over 41000 denominations of Christianity. And this is only those that have established distinct recognizable churches, different than other churches. It does not include varying individual Christian beliefs, where the person either doesn't go to any church or just goes to the church that most closely matches their own beliefs.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  9. #1059
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    again what does this have to do with anything? oh thats right nothing since religion factually has nothgin to do with legal marriage.
    Only that you had said that gay marriage was a Christian thing to do. I thought it only right to point out to you that one of the guys who defines these things is of different opinion than you. If you want to go on believing it, it is fine by me.

  10. #1060
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it? (PART II)

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Meanings of words change with time, particularly in the subtle way that this one is.

    And right now, despite popular belief, there is, overall, very little tax advantage to being married. It all depends on the couple. Almost as many people pay more in taxes married than they would if they were single. This has been proven. All the married tax filing does is make it easier for everyone so that two people who own the some of the same stuff, such as land, a house/houses, and/or cars can file for this without figuring out who owns what percentage of that. The things like tax credits or other such tax parts are doubled because there are two people. It is merely doubled. In the past, it wasn't even doubled. Married people were getting gypped because they were being treated as one tax entity even if both people were working and earning money, which put them in a higher tax bracket simply because of their marriage. In fact, even now that can happen and harm couples due solely to each would be in a lower tax bracket without their marriage but their marriage puts them in such a higher bracket that they end up paying more from that higher bracket than they would from the lower ones combined. Other people it works out for them to benefit them.

    The Congressional Budget Committee has already studied this and determined that the "benefit" of marriage to individuals is insignificant compared to many other things that give tax payers benefits.

    Plus, marriage is a benefit to society, and that accounts easily for any benefits that are seen by married couples compared to single individuals. This too has evidence to back it up. And it has nothing to do with whether or not the couple has children. That is simply another way being married benefits society, by showing that two individuals in a committed relationship are raising those children. But there is also the benefit of more money being spent, the fact that married people are proven to be more stable overall than single people, there is someone there for an adult to turn to first before they need to rely on the government/society for help should they fall on hard times, and many more. We give tax advantages for things that benefit society, including making homes much more energy efficient, giving to charity, and going to college, among just a few.
    I think I understand the social functions of marriage and the tax implications okay and you are about right, but not quite.


    For one thing the alteration of the word's meaning is quite significant. Alone the reproductive function of marriage would exemplify that. If reproduction is not possible it is not marriage. Also it would seem to me a substantial benefit to reduce taxes by Half. I can't do that for my cleaning man. I can only deduct him.

    But do not get me wrong. I see no problem in civil contracts for living together. I just would not call it marriage. And I think that probably the subsidies for marriage are wrong to begin with. Tax money should only be used for thinks whose benefit to society can be quantified.

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