View Poll Results: Gay marriage should be legal in America

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Thread: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

  1. #121
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    Re: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Why?

    Perhaps I'm not seeing potential problems...

    But it seems to me that creating a legal institution that compliments and supports marriage while not actually being such would not cause much issue.
    Its unconstitutional. Its discrimination, oh well you're not good enough for marriage, so we'll give you civil unions. It's the same kind of thinking as well I don't want black kids in the same school as my white kids, so we'll give them their own separate school.
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  2. #122
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    Re: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    Its unconstitutional. Its discrimination, oh well you're not good enough for marriage, so we'll give you civil unions. It's the same kind of thinking as well I don't want black kids in the same school as my white kids, so we'll give them their own separate school.
    No no.

    I meant that the only marriage-like legal institution - for everyone - would not be called marriage. Not a seperate institution for same-sex couples, a seperate institution from marriage.
    Last edited by The Mark; 08-06-10 at 11:02 PM.
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    Re: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    No no.

    I meant that the only marriage-like legal institution - for everyone - would not be called marriage. Not a seperate institution for same-sex couples, a seperate institution from marriage.
    Oh, okay. Yeah that would be okay. Taking the word marriage out of government, and just offering civil unions I wouldn't have a problem with. Though I wonder how many people against gay marriage would be against taking the word marriage out of government also.
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    Re: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    Oh, okay. Yeah that would be okay. Taking the word marriage out of government, and just offering civil unions I wouldn't have a problem with. Though I wonder how many people against gay marriage would be against taking the word marriage out of government also.
    No idea.

    I can't see why they would...but then, unreasonable thoughts rarely make sense.
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  5. #125
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    Re: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    Its unconstitutional. Its discrimination, oh well you're not good enough for marriage, so we'll give you civil unions. It's the same kind of thinking as well I don't want black kids in the same school as my white kids, so we'll give them their own separate school.
    Cross-posted in another thread, since I just addressed this there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav View Post
    Here's my gripe with the same-sex marriage laws/inter-racial marriage laws comparison.

    In the decision that deemed inter-racial marriage laws unconstitutional, Loving v Virginia, the SC seemed reluctant to reach that conclusion because part of the defending argument was true, i.e. that all races could still marry someone within their own race (similar to the argument that marriage law doesn't discriminate agianst gays because they can still legally marry someone of the opposite gender like everyone else) which would make it difficult to fit under the Equal Protection Clause. Ultimately they reached the final conclusion because 1. race is an arbitrary categorization that matters only in a racist point of view, and 2. the inent of the law was clearly to discriminate against non-whites, which violated the 14th Amendment. From Wikipedia:



    Neither qualifiers work in the current case. As Zyphlin said, it is actually gender, not sexual orientation, that marriage laws themselves discriminate. This in itself is important, but not the main point. Gender is not an arbitrary categorization (though that's what the judge in this case argues) and current marriage law is not set up to discriminate against either men or women (or gays, for that matter). Marriage is between a man and a woman because, frankly, the entire reason marriage exists is for reproduction. I'm not saying that's the only reason people should get married for, but the fact is that it is the cultural basis for marriage's existence. That fact alone makes it difficult to provide a Constitutional argument against current marriage law on a 14th Amendment basis.

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    Re: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

    I'm 100% in favor for marriage for everybody. My objection to removing the word marriage is that you can't just take a word out of the international lexicon. People get married and they have a marriage. What would it be otherwise? We have a civil union, we're unionized? Naw, man. It doesn't make any sense.

  7. #127
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    Re: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    But it seems to me that creating a legal institution that compliments and supports marriage while not actually being such would not cause much issue.
    My primary objection is to creating an alternative to marriage that does not carry the same weight of tradition behind it. Extending the legal benefits of marriage to an institution that does not have the same cultural and societal authority undermines the value of marriage and actually discourages people from getting married.

  8. #128
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    Re: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    What's wrong with it? It's simple:

    Marriage = man + woman + legal recognition

    <fill in the space> = man + man / woman + woman + legal recognition
    When you can show how a homosexual union can not be considered a marriage, let me know. Oh, and the gender or sexual orientation of the participants is irrelevant if we are trying to see if a homosexual union fits, here.
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    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

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  9. #129
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    Re: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Forgive me if the wording seemed too strong or provocative. It is my belief that marriage is defined as a union between a man and a woman. As I said in my post, I can support civil unions with identical marriage benefits. I cannot support calling something a marriage that is not a marriage (in my opinion).
    I can accept that is your opinion. It doesn't fit how marriage works, in a universal sense, though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  10. #130
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    Re: Gay marriage should be a constitutional right in America

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    Thats a separate but equal institution. You can't do that. The only way that would fly is if you took marriage out of the government all together, and only offer civil unions to everybody.
    Generally, this is my position. Probably the best solution, too. It leaves marriage to religion, and civil unions... contracts, to the government.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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