View Poll Results: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

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  • Yes I have, explain please

    4 11.43%
  • No I haven't

    25 71.43%
  • No I haven't but I have seen others lose their jobs because of illegal immigrants

    2 5.71%
  • other

    4 11.43%
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Thread: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

  1. #31
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    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
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    Re: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    Hatuey pretty much hit upon it. Welcome to the wild, wild world of capitalism. It's free market, where the survival is still of the fittest.

    This is what happens when America thinks they're entitled to everything, including jobs. But instead of becoming more competitive, we just bitch. It's Japan in the late 80s all over again. America doesn't want to get leaner and meaner, so they brainwash people into hyper-protectionism and villify people for buying something cheaper and better because it's produced overseas.

    Personally, I welcome it to an extent. Instead of having some lazy piece of crap whine about how he can do the most basic of jobs for minimum wage, Hector will do it for half the price, with a huge grin on his face, and the respect of saying "si, senor". Sorry, I don't have a tilde on this keyboard.

    Hector embraces the system, so why can't we?
    That's not true at all.

    I have no problems with the Chinese doing jobs more efficiently.
    They don't move to our country illegally and break laws to work (for the most part).
    They produce it with in the legal bounds of their countries.

    When someone moves into my country and gets to ignore the laws, I'm supposed to follow.
    When employers are also allowed to ignore the law on many levels.
    Then I have problems.

    They have an unfair advantage that I don't.
    So no, it's not that simple.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  2. #32
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    Re: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

    I mostly worry about illegal immigrants being victimized.
    Often, they are the victims of crimes, and are afraid to report this because they fear being deported.
    I also don't like to see them taken advantage of by employers.
    It makes me sad to see them living a dozen to an apartment, and doing their laundry so carefully- four or five different laundry products, all of them from Mexico and smelling like heaven.
    It breaks my heart to see them standing together on the street corner early in the morning, while it's still dark outside, dressed so nicely in their button-down shirts and pressed pants, waiting for a truck to come by and take them to their construction jobs.

    They try so hard.
    They deserve better treatment than they get.

  3. #33
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    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
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    Re: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    I mostly worry about illegal immigrants being victimized.
    Often, they are the victims of crimes, and are afraid to report this because they fear being deported.
    I also don't like to see them taken advantage of by employers.
    It makes me sad to see them living a dozen to an apartment, and doing their laundry so carefully- four or five different laundry products, all of them from Mexico and smelling like heaven.
    It breaks my heart to see them standing together on the street corner early in the morning, while it's still dark outside, dressed so nicely in their button-down shirts and pressed pants, waiting for a truck to come by and take them to their construction jobs.

    They try so hard.
    They deserve better treatment than they get.
    I have compassion for those that want to live here permanently and wouldn't mind an amnesty for them.

    My problem stems from people those that like to paint me as some sort of bigoted ass because I'm calling foul on the fact that illegal aliens aren't required to follow the law, I'm supposed to follow.

    How the hell can I compete with that?
    Last edited by Harry Guerrilla; 08-01-10 at 05:58 PM.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  4. #34
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    Re: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    If you had bothered to actually read the rest of his post you'd have seen it has more to do with the feeling of entitlement American workers have in regards to jobs. Harry Guerilla said it best, he wants to be paid more to kill chickens. Why? What makes killing chickens for 12 hours worth more than $10 an hour? What makes it worth more than $5 an hour? If I want to pay less for unskilled labor why shouldn't I? Instead of competition you have a market of entitlement. You believe you should be paid more for your services than a worker doing the same job in Pakistan. Illegal immigrants keep everybody else competitive in their prices. Instead of having workers engage in cartel-like practices they keep their prices in competititon.
    No it's not entitlement.
    There are requirements here, that some people don't have to follow, because of lax enforcement by state and federal officials.
    You've totally mischaracterized my words.

    The labor market isn't a "free" market.
    There are legal requirements that both the individual and the business are supposed to follow.
    When you allow one group to ignore those rules, it creates a two tiered system.
    The person that is allowed to ignore those standards will have an inherent advantage over the person who isn't.

    You don't know what you're talking about.
    You seem to only want to troll and insult me (and others).
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  5. #35
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    Re: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    No it's not entitlement.
    There are requirements here, that some people don't have to follow, because of lax enforcement by state and federal officials.
    You've totally mischaracterized my words.

    The labor market isn't a "free" market.
    There are legal requirements that both the individual and the business are supposed to follow.
    When you allow one group to ignore those rules, it creates a two tiered system.
    The person that is allowed to ignore those standards will have an inherent advantage over the person who isn't.

    You don't know what you're talking about.
    You seem to only want to troll and insult me (and others).

    Well, that's the thing; illegal immigrants work under the table, usually for cash.
    Therefore, taxes are not deducted from their wages.
    So they can afford to work for less than people who do pay taxes (although they still, in my opinion, suffer; even without being made to pay taxes, the wages they receive are not enough to support a decent quality of life).

    It seems to me the answer is amnesty for all who are now here, allow then to work legally as guest workers or something, force employers to pay them a living wage, and then deduct taxes from it.
    Everyone wins.

  6. #36
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    Re: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    Well, that's the thing; illegal immigrants work under the table, usually for cash.
    Therefore, taxes are not deducted from their wages.
    So they can afford to work for less than people who do pay taxes (although they still, in my opinion, suffer; even without being made to pay taxes, the wages they receive are not enough to support a decent quality of life).

    It seems to me the answer is amnesty for all who are now here, allow then to work legally as guest workers or something, force employers to pay them a living wage, and then deduct taxes from it.
    Everyone wins.
    They aren't suffering, not living totally by American standards but definitely not suffering.
    The boarding houses are relatively well maintained.
    A lot of the guys I know do pretty well.

    If you make employers follow the wage laws, illegal labor will not be used.
    Most of these guys here don't pay overtime to their illegal laborers, that's a huge advantage over someone like me.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  7. #37
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    Re: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

    Not that I'm aware of.

    But how would I know, one way or the other?
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  8. #38
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    Re: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    Well, that's the thing; illegal immigrants work under the table, usually for cash.
    Therefore, taxes are not deducted from their wages.
    So they can afford to work for less than people who do pay taxes (although they still, in my opinion, suffer; even without being made to pay taxes, the wages they receive are not enough to support a decent quality of life).

    It seems to me the answer is amnesty for all who are now here, allow then to work legally as guest workers or something, force employers to pay them a living wage, and then deduct taxes from it.
    Everyone wins.
    The better answer is fines and jail time for the employers of the invaders. It doesn't matter if they sufer, they weren't invited in the first place, and the less they like it here, the more incentive they have to LEAVE.

    There's an idea you can focus on, instead of the looney idea of encouraging more law breaking by forgiving law breaking.

  9. #39
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    Re: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    I mostly worry about illegal immigrants being victimized.
    I understand.

    That's why I want them to GO HOME

    That's the answer to their problems.

  10. #40
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    Re: Have you ever lost out on a job due to illegal immigrants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    I have had to turn down some opportunities because the specific job sectors didn't pay enough, largely because they were populated by illegal immigrants.

    12 hour days, making approximately minimum wage, isn't good pay for eviscerating chickens.
    Nobody complains when they get their chickens cheap, their fruit cheap, their California wine cheap, their cars washed cheap or 100 things that we get cheap because businesses keep their labor costs low...

    AZ eats their share of burgers made with meat from Texas and produce picked in CA...

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