View Poll Results: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

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Thread: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

  1. #211
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    Re: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Great.
    And how would -any- of that have changed your response to my question?
    Well lets see...

    If you had stated:

    If your purpose is what it CLEARLY was, which was being spurred by Obama's comment and referencing his comment, you could've gone.
    I would probably have responded by stating that in theory I agree with him. The whole notion of "African" American is a bit questionable now, as while historically one could trace linieage there many black people could perhaps claim more European or Carribean blood perhaps than pure "african" blood. Blacks, as well as many whites, could easily be considered "mongrels" in that fashion at this point as the ethnic lineage has became so mixed within the various races and that it'll likely continue to be that way. With the easier its became to travel across the world now it will continually be harder to find "french" people or "african" people or "English" people who are 100% or even 75% of a particular ethnic bloodline.

    That said it's another example of poor judgement on his part using that particular word. While technically it may fit, the word has a definitive negative connotation in the normal and typical usage of it and is just going to invite a potential firestorm. This is akin to suggesting that someone is "queer" because they are odd, while it may technically be true the term is far more often used in modern times as an insult or derogatory way of referencing someone as a homosexual and as such would likely not be the wisest word to use regardless of its technical correctness.

    Now, if you ahd stated this

    If your purpose was HONESTLY not trying to set a trap and were meaning this in an entirely generalized way you could've gone
    I'd likely state that its multifaceted and would depend on how or why someone was using it. In a very generalized way I'd say its likely meant to be insulting, as the common use and reference to mongrel in most speech today is referencing to rabid dogs or mangy dogs. Thus its either refering to black individuals as savages or something less than human. That said, if using it in its more literal, technical definition it could be something that is considered accurate due to the natural mixed ethnicity that is common today...however if someone was using it only to describe blacks I'd suggest an alterior motive to them since most races at this point in humanity could be considered "mongrels" to a point under that definition.

  2. #212
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    Re: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Disagree? Would your answer to the question change depending any of the above things?
    Context is one of the reasons why we allow a grace-period for editing posts... to clarify context. To pretend that context is a frivolous concept without utility and purpose is, once again... a disingenuous and dishonest position.

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  3. #213
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    Re: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    Context is one of the reasons why we allow a grace-period for editing posts... to clarify context. To pretend that context is a frivolous concept without utility and purpose is, once again... a disingenuous and dishonest position.
    You did not answer the question(s).

  4. #214
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    Re: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    You did not answer the question(s).
    Quite frankly, your pedantic little games bore me.

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    Re: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Could someone have voted for Thurmond and not been supporting segregation, given Thurmond's platform at the time?
    Sure. Someone could have voted for Thurmond for any reason under the sun, just as they could have done so for any candidate who ever ran for anything.

    Was Lott in the habit of making pro-segregationist comments? Did he support pro-segregationist legislation?
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    Re: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    You're just repeating the same thing you said in the last post. My answer, therefore, is the same.

    I don't disagree with you about Thurmond. It's not about Thurmond.
    But it is about Thurmond. Its DIRECTLY about Thurmond. Its about Lott saying the country would've been better off if it had elected Thurmond.

    To suggest that is to suggest the country would've been better off if Thurmond had been able to push his agenda, as it'd make no sense to want Thurmond in but NOT to have his agenda occur as that'd be no different than him not making it into the Presidency.

    To suggest that the country would've been better off with Thurmonds agenda is to suggest that the country would've been better off with Segregationism because that was the CORE of Thurmonds platform.

    That was the entire main focus for their Platform and their legislation, if that's not what you actually mean to speak about when talking about Dixiecrats then its incumbant on you to clarify because its absolutely reasonable to assume that without clarification you're talking about them as a whole.

  7. #217
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    Re: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Really?
    Knowing this, how does your answer change?
    I still have not answered your poll question, because I still do not know the whole context.


    This was clarified. Sorry that you werent paying attention, but that's on you.
    No it has not. What was the question he was answering? What was his overall point with the comment? Without knowing things like that, it is impossible to judge.


    Knowing that someone did or did not say it, how does your answer change?
    See above. I still have not answered the poll.


    ... avoid the question.
    All you ARE doing is embarassing yourself.
    Hey look, a comment out of context. Some one is embarrassing themselves here, but it is not me.
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  8. #218
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    Re: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Sure. Someone could have voted for Thurmond for any reason under the sun, just as they could have done so for any candidate who ever ran for anything.

    Was Lott in the habit of making pro-segregationist comments? Did he support pro-segregationist legislation?
    Except Strom Thurmonds platform and purpose at that point was almost singularly surrounding the issue of Segregation.

    If you state your position of support for an individual whose entire platform is based off the belief that all drugs should be legalized, and it states it bluntly in two of its platform statements, every other platform statement directly relates to it, and all your legislative pushes have primarily been based around legalizing drugs...and you do not specifically state you support him for the reasons other than his views on drugs...its absolutely reasonable to assume that you support his views on drugs because that's the main, primarily, core focus of that individual.

    Strom Thurmonds run for the Presidency in 1948 under the Dixiecrats was directly and nearly singularly predicated off the notion that segregation should continue and as such state rights need to be strenghtened to assure it. Unless someone actually clarifies why they're saying Strom Thurmond winning would've been better for America, its reasonable to assume no matter who the person is that they're in part speaking about Segregation since that was the MAIN thing Thurmond was advocating for and the individual spoke in a broad way which implies a broad support.

    If there are additional comments from Lott that I've not found in searching on this where he immedietely before or after states how Thurmands views on Segregation and his motivation for his states rights views was wrong, but ultimately his states rights views were correct and we would've overturned segregation shortly after anyways, then I'd agree 100% with you. To my knowledge I've found nothing further from the context to suggest that's there. And while I don't know a great deal of Lotts history (the fact he hasn't push for segregation is irrelevant as he's hardly been heavily politically active during the time period where that was actually common) there is nothing about him that is so obviously counter to make me assume him making a gigantically broad statement about a man whose platform was singularly inspired by Segregationism somehow wasn't speaking broadly.

    Do I think that means Trent Lott directly, specifically, is in favor of segregationism? No. What I do think it means is that Trent Lott thinks this country would've been better off with a party in power whose goal was to cause segregation to continue, and that in and of itself is unquestionably wrong and sad. If that was not his intention then he shouldn't have given such broad and open support to a guy whose platform was focused on such.

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    Re: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Except Strom Thurmonds platform and purpose at that point was almost singularly surrounding the issue of Segregation.

    If you state your position of support for an individual whose entire platform is based off the belief that all drugs should be legalized, and it states it bluntly in two of its platform statements, every other platform statement directly relates to it, and all your legislative pushes have primarily been based around legalizing drugs...and you do not specifically state you support him for the reasons other than his views on drugs...its absolutely reasonable to assume that you support his views on drugs because that's the main, primarily, core focus of that individual.

    Strom Thurmonds run for the Presidency in 1948 under the Dixiecrats was directly and nearly singularly predicated off the notion that segregation should continue and as such state rights need to be strenghtened to assure it. Unless someone actually clarifies why they're saying Strom Thurmond winning would've been better for America, its reasonable to assume no matter who the person is that they're in part speaking about Segregation since that was the MAIN thing Thurmond was advocating for and the individual spoke in a broad way which implies a broad support.
    Are you going to just keep repeating this as though I didn't respond to it the first time?
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  10. #220
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    Re: Are African-Americans a mongrel people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Sure. Someone could have voted for Thurmond for any reason under the sun, just as they could have done so for any candidate who ever ran for anything.
    I wasn't asking for their reasoning behind their vote.

    I'm was asking about the results of their vote.

    Someone could not vote for Obama, for xample, without giving their support to his agenda as well. It's not possible.


    Was Lott in the habit of making pro-segregationist comments? Did he support pro-segregationist legislation?
    Trent Lott's Segregationist College Days - TIME

    Supposedly from lott's own mouth:

    Yes, you could say I favored segregation then. I don't now. The main thing was, I felt the federal government had no business sending in troops to tell the state what to do.
    Now, regardless of how one feels about his reasoning, the comment was deservedly criticized, given his history. It is not at all comparable to the use of the term niggardly, or mongrel in this context, or even Reid's use of the term "negro dialect"
    Last edited by Tucker Case; 07-30-10 at 04:15 PM.
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