View Poll Results: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

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Thread: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

  1. #81
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    Re: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

    Quote Originally Posted by the makeout hobo View Post
    I can give you a natural monopoly: PG&E, or any other electrical company. Due to the nature of electrical grids, it is nigh impossible to have more than one supplier deliver to a neighborhood.
    Those are natural monopolies put into place by the government.

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    Re: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

    A perfect example of a natural monopoly that has nothing to do with the government is pay-per-view movies.

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    Re: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

    Quote Originally Posted by drz-400 View Post
    A perfect example of a natural monopoly that has nothing to do with the government is pay-per-view movies.
    How is that a monopoly?
    Haymarket's "support" of the 2nd Amendment, a right he believes we never had.
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    no. You cannot lose rights you do not have in the first place. There is no such thing as the right to have any weapon of your choice regardless of any other consideration. It simply does not exist.

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    Re: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lachean View Post
    How is that a monopoly?
    Those who offer pay per view movies have market power, since the price is not equal to marginal cost. The average cost is always higher than the marginal cost. It has increasing returns to scale. Therefore, it is most efficient for one firm to produce pay-per-view movies.

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    Re: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

    Quote Originally Posted by crebigsol View Post
    Do you agree with me?

    If you don't, why do you think/know the opposite is truer?

    If you do, you must have seen the reason: Monopoly in a certain field means absolute power in this field.
    I neither agree nor disagree. I simply don’t know.

    Why is it assured (from your perspective) that an entity, upon or shortly after achieving a monopoly in its field of business, will loose the factors that got it that monopoly status?

    If they did, a competitor would shortly arise, with the same factors in its favor, to eliminate their monopoly, or so it seems to me.

    Would they not strive to keep competitors from entering the market, or at the least from eliminating their monopoly?

    And if we are only considering lawful and fair methods here, the factors I mentioned would be quite important in accomplishing that…Wouldn’t they?

    Perhaps I’m not seeing your point…
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    Re: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    I neither agree nor disagree. I simply don’t know.

    Why is it assured (from your perspective) that an entity, upon or shortly after achieving a monopoly in its field of business, will loose the factors that got it that monopoly status?

    If they did, a competitor would shortly arise, with the same factors in its favor, to eliminate their monopoly, or so it seems to me.

    Would they not strive to keep competitors from entering the market, or at the least from eliminating their monopoly?

    And if we are only considering lawful and fair methods here, the factors I mentioned would be quite important in accomplishing that…Wouldn’t they?

    Perhaps I’m not seeing your point…
    If I say "absolute power leads to absolute corruption", you may say I am too general and abstract.

    One thing for sure is that, whatever an entity is, striving for comfort is its ultimate goal to access to a monopolization state. Striving for service is not in such goal, although the service, after acquiring the monopoly status, has become a continuous tool to extract comfort. The evolvement from being good to less good is not to happen over night, but gradually; it has been allowed to do so because no competitors gives it pressure any more. Your " upon or shortly after" has also indicated this gradual evolvement.

    Once such entity becomes a monopoly, its constant target is to make sure to kill the appearance of competitor, not the happiness of those who expect service from this entity. AS to how to kill, it is too involved to address here, but definitely not through good service. Perhapse, throat slitting low price maybe one of the strategies in killing, but only for a while, good only till the new competitor is dead.

    Of course, the anti-trust law will forbid the monopoly entity from abusing its monopoly status, but this not the nature of the monopoly entity.

    "And if we are only considering lawful and fair methods here, the factors I mentioned would be quite important in accomplishing that…Wouldn’t they?" Yes, ideally. But how often can we live ideally? Almost never!

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    Re: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Theoretically, it doesn't need to be a monopoly.
    We'd have to switch to DC to make it work in a competitive environment though.
    I suppose it could continue as AC.

    Those type of monopolies are on their way out(albeit slowly), with the advent and more popular usage of solar panels.
    I really don't see how AC power could be anything other than a monopoly (don't know about DC delivery enough to comment). Either way, it naturally forms a monopoly by nature of delivery.
    The Makeout Hobo is real, and does indeed travel around the country in his van and make out with ladies... If you meet the Makeout Hobo, it is customary to greet him with a shot of whiskey and a high five (if you are a dude) or passionate makeouts (if you are a lady).

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    Re: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    Those are natural monopolies put into place by the government.
    Please explain to me how to make it anything other than a natural monopoly. I think you are dead wrong on this one.
    The Makeout Hobo is real, and does indeed travel around the country in his van and make out with ladies... If you meet the Makeout Hobo, it is customary to greet him with a shot of whiskey and a high five (if you are a dude) or passionate makeouts (if you are a lady).

  9. #89
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    Re: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

    The problem here is people separating government from business. For instance if we had a "stateless" free market or anarcho-capitalism there would in fact be government because it would arise from the businesses that emerge. To consider it another way think about empires. These governments are not enabled by some global government yet gain a "monopoly" of sorts on territories, especially strategically significant territories.

    In an unrestricted free market business would naturally pursue more and more business, as well as trying to get rid of their competition. Any success at doing either builds momentum. The more a business expands the more capable it gets at extinguishing competition. The more competition it removes, the more the business expands. Theoretically this process could go on until it gains absolute control of an industry.

    Also one has to consider that an unrestricted free market might lead to vertical integration of a company. Retailers buying out the manufacturers of goods and so forth. There is also the cartel system where several major businesses cooperate to control an industry.

    One would likely see both systems become more frequent in an unrestricted free market and a number of methods being employed to lock out competitors. Indeed, the notion of "stateless" free markets is absurd. Business would function as the State and like all states they would seek to increase their control until they had absolute power.
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    Re: Do you believe in natural monopolies?

    Quote Originally Posted by crebigsol View Post
    If I say "absolute power leads to absolute corruption", you may say I am too general and abstract.

    One thing for sure is that, whatever an entity is, striving for comfort is its ultimate goal to access to a monopolization state. Striving for service is not in such goal, although the service, after acquiring the monopoly status, has become a continuous tool to extract comfort. The evolvement from being good to less good is not to happen over night, but gradually; it has been allowed to do so because no competitors gives it pressure any more. Your " upon or shortly after" has also indicated this gradual evolvement.

    Once such entity becomes a monopoly, its constant target is to make sure to kill the appearance of competitor, not the happiness of those who expect service from this entity. AS to how to kill, it is too involved to address here, but definitely not through good service. Perhapse, throat slitting low price maybe one of the strategies in killing, but only for a while, good only till the new competitor is dead.

    Of course, the anti-trust law will forbid the monopoly entity from abusing its monopoly status, but this not the nature of the monopoly entity.

    "And if we are only considering lawful and fair methods here, the factors I mentioned would be quite important in accomplishing that…Wouldn’t they?" Yes, ideally. But how often can we live ideally? Almost never!
    So we wouldn't need anti-trust laws if we had laws that somehow prevented those negative methods directed at preventing/eliminating competition which you speak of?
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

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