I watched the videos, and I agree
I didn't watch the videos, and I agree
I watched the videos, and I disagree
I didn't watch the videos, and I disagree
I still don't know
Don't know, and further don't care
Other (there's always one ....)
Ever heard of Andrea Gibson?
Even though not all men I've dated have these facial templates, there is definitely a pattern I see. The ones that don't have these templates tend to be at a different spectrum on the sexuality scale, IMO, even though they choose to identify with the label "gay". These ones usually admit that they've had experiences with women in the past before they "decided" they prefer men, or they came out late.
I really do think that the labeling scheme makes the matter too confusing. A definitive label doesn't allow people to really self-examine where they are on the sexuality spectrum, and even if they do, most people's place on that spectrum doesn't remain static. I think there are people who are truly close to being 100% gay and if our society didn't have same-sex norms they would just be single their whole lives; but not everyone rests on that spectrum. Also, it fails to account for what people feel like doing in the moment, as it restricts their actions to a rule set. I think without the social rules, many, many more people would be open to experimenting or being with the same-sex in the moment.
My sister came out as gay when she was 21. Then went into a phase where she dated men and called herself straight. Then ended up with women again. Now she's married to a man and has a kid. She told me she just stopped trying to choose a label. I asked her, "Why don't you just identify as bisexual?" She said, "Because maybe today, I'm straight. Maybe today I only want to be with a man. Maybe tomorrow it would only be with a woman, and the day after I am having attractions to either. On some days I feel completely asexual and don't want to be with anyone. On any given day my sexuality feels concrete. So to say that I'm bisexual each and every day is wrong."
I think people should just stop making weird rules about how they should behave and do what they want, but I acknowledge that my ideas may be too advanced for a society that is still having trouble acknowledging that same-sex attractions are normal.
So stroke another man's dick because I stroke my own?Originally Posted by BDBoop
GEEZUS CAWT TEH GAI.
I wish more high-brow posters would add their 2 cents.
I know, right? By the way; your PM box is full.
I don't really care if being gay is a choice or not. It doesn't matter. We should all be free to be whatever we want to be on any given day. A lot of people are like your sister. They're not really able to define themselves sexually and I don't think they should ever be expected to.
"Yes, but are you a Protestant atheist or a Catholic atheist?".- Northern Irish joke
When I was in China there were a few very attractive Chinese men that I met who were very flirly with me. I'm not normally into Asian guys but every now and then there are a few lookers who come my way. They were super flirtatious, asking me out for drinks, asking me if I had a girlfriend. It was so obvious that they were "gay"... but every time I asked them if they had a boyfriend, or they were seeing a guy, or if they were gay, they became offended and stopped talking to me. It was through these hard lessons that I eventually learned that "gay" is an identity that we choose in the western world. It is new and not historically normal to adhere to such labels.
"Gay" people in traditional Asia don't see themselves as gay. As soon as you ask them if they are gay, it conjures images of all of the queer men in North America and Europe who dance in their underwear on floats on pride day. They immediately reject the notion. But they still sleep with men, even if they are fulfilling their traditional obligation of marrying a woman and having a child. They simply don't call it anything or choose an identity based on their behavior.
I think our world would be a lot better off without the labels. Even if I'm into men 100% of the time, why should I call myself gay?
Again, I think this discussion is an advanced level for people to grasp, but before our society ever had "gay", it had men who slept with men in secret. Perhaps all these labels will just be an issue before they are eventually a non-issue, and people come to realize that sexuality is this fluidic, nebulous collection of desires that don't need to have a specific rationale.
Last edited by Orion; 07-23-10 at 03:06 PM.
Orion, that makes sense right across the board. Especially in America, where a rather large segment of the population uses labels to decide how they think. It's not even actually thinking, it's reacting. I think that's part of why Andrea Gibson (whom I love) uses the term Queer so regularly. It's just one of the labels that people react to in a certain way, but if they are listening to her they have to see that she is who she is, and 'queer' is just a part of it. She is brilliant, intelligent, funny, quick-witted, loving, open, honest - and that's just what I learned watching her videos and doing a bit of net research.
For me, I don't care if it's hardwired or if it's by choice.
Live and let live, I always say.
I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.