View Poll Results: Is Taxation Slavery?

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  • Yes

    18 17.14%
  • No

    78 74.29%
  • Other (Explain)

    9 8.57%
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Thread: Is Taxation Slavery?

  1. #571
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    I do have proof that you do not have an argument. You have admitted yourself that you cannot provide information to substantiate your claim and instead claim that I must buy a book to prove you right -> http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls/...post1058858541. Also, I have shown you the initial post in which I asked you to prove your claim and I have shown that I have not moved goal posts as you were responding to LiberalAvenger -> http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls/...post1058858476.

    So I will ask again, can you cite that private charities can keep up with the needs of the financially handicapped?
    I didn't change the goal posts, but you did. If you want to know then educate yourself since it was never my argument. It was always Yourstar's argument.

    Youstar stated in post #446, "Private charities don't have the reliability of the government. They can be there for you one month, but not the next. The government won't do that." There is no link to back up Yourstar's statement regarding reliability.

    In post #450 Youstar claimed, "Your over exaggerating the effectiveness of those charities. Before welfare programs it was quite literally do or die." Again no link to back up Yourstar's statement about the effectiveness of private charity.

    The link Yourstar provided in post #453 never goes back to the 1700's and starts in the 1920's. It is invalid as a source against the data of private charities from the 1700's-1919. You asserted that private charities in the 1700's-1919 were unreliable and ineffective and you failed to provide proof.
    If you are going to credit someone for an argument at least do it with the right person.

  2. #572
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtpoorchris View Post
    Pay unto Ceaser what is Ceaser's.
    Don't use his money and add to his cause if it is against your morals or code of honor.
    Except the people are Caeser not the government. The government is a servant not a master.

  3. #573
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    I didn't change the goal posts, but you did. If you want to know then educate yourself since it was never my argument. It was always Yourstar's argument.

    If you are going to credit someone for an argument at least do it with the right person.
    Don't give me that red herring. Just be honest and admit you have no evidence to support your claim that charity can keep up with the needs of the financially handicapped.

  4. #574
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Don't give me that red herring. Just be honest and admit you have no evidence to support your claim that charity can keep up with the needs of the financially handicapped.
    There we go again moving the goal posts when I provided proof that the effectiveness and reliability of charity was not my argument. You have a tendency of doing that since this will make the third time you've moved the goal posts. You make an argument then prove it, so far you haven't proven that charity was unreliable and ineffective (since you are on Yourstar's side of the debate you have to prove it.)

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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    There we go again moving the goal posts when I provided proof that the effectiveness and reliability of charity was not my argument. You have a tendency of doing that since this will make the third time you've moved the goal posts. You make an argument then prove it, so far you haven't proven that charity was unreliable and ineffective (since you are on Yourstar's side of the debate you have to prove it.)
    First of all, I am on my own side of the debate. It is up to her to defend herself. Second of all, please show me how I am moving the goal posts. I have shown at least twice now that all I want is for you to prove your assertion that you claimed against LiberalAvenger's post. Once you have either proved it or rescinded the statement, we will move on.
    Last edited by tacomancer; 07-15-10 at 07:14 PM.

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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    This whole disagreement triangle between megaprogman, The_Patroit, and Yourstar is getting quite complex and hard to follow.

    Perhaps if everyone started over, something other than an argument about how the other guy is arguing would occur?

    Still, it’s entertaining.


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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    First of all, I am on my own side of the debate. It is up to her to defend herself. Second of all, please show me how I am moving the goal posts. I have shown at least twice now that all I want is for you to prove your assertion that you claimed against LiberalAvenger's post. Once you have either proved it or rescind the statement, we will move on.
    In post #445 I stated, "Not true since private charities were able to do so for over a hundred years before the government got involved. The government hates competition."

    In post #446 Your Star replied with, "Private charities don't have the reliability of the government. They can be there for you one month, but not the next. The government won't do that."

    In post #447 you replied to my argument, "Do you have any data to support this assertion?"

    In post #448 Your Star asserted, "Your over exaggerating the effectiveness of those charities. Before welfare programs it was quite literally do or die."

    I responded to it in post #449#449, "Will this suffice?" with a link to the Philanthropic Society's history section.

    In post #452 you replied, "No because it does not address the real question. Yes there have been examples of philanthropy throughout time, what I want to see is that if it is enough to take care of everyone in need."

    You moved the goal post there since that was never my argument, but Your Star's.

    In post #461 you moved the goal posts again by using an invalid comparison to prove that charity was ineffective and reliable from 1700-1919 by posting up an article about prostitution during the 19th century. In post #471 you demanded I back up my position with data and I did on the argument I made originally. Afterthat, you have misattributed Your Star's argument to me. By doing so you have moved the goal post again by letting Your Star slide on not providing proof of her argument and moving it onto me.

    Since Your Star and you have failed to provide any proof that charity was unreliable and ineffective, I did not need to provide proof of my own under the rules of debate. You and her both used rhetoric and opinion, so I replied in kind with opinion.

    Going back through it, Liberal Avenger originally made the claim that private charities cannot keep up with the needs of the financially handicapped in post #438. He failed to provide proof to back up his assertation. Since there is no proof provided and only opinion I replied with only opinion due to the rules of debate. My apologies to Your Star for misattributing that argument to you.
    Last edited by The_Patriot; 07-15-10 at 07:37 PM.

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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    In post #445 I stated, "Not true since private charities were able to do so for over a hundred years before the government got involved. The government hates competition."

    In post #446 Your Star replied with, "Private charities don't have the reliability of the government. They can be there for you one month, but not the next. The government won't do that."

    In post #447 you replied to my argument, "Do you have any data to support this assertion?"

    In post #448 Your Star asserted, "Your over exaggerating the effectiveness of those charities. Before welfare programs it was quite literally do or die."

    I responded to it in post #449#449, "Will this suffice?" with a link to the Philanthropic Society's history section.

    In post #452 you replied, "No because it does not address the real question. Yes there have been examples of philanthropy throughout time, what I want to see is that if it is enough to take care of everyone in need."

    You moved the goal post there since that was never my argument, but Your Star's.

    In post #461 you moved the goal posts again by using an invalid comparison to prove that charity was ineffective and reliable from 1700-1919 by posting up an article about prostitution during the 19th century. In post #471 you demanded I back up my position with data and I did on the argument I made originally. Afterthat, you have misattributed Your Star's argument to me. By doing so you have moved the goal post again by letting Your Star slide on not providing proof of her argument and moving it onto me.
    Yourstar and I are two different people dude.

    But lets look at these two quotes.

    In post #445 (Is Taxation Slavery?) I stated, "Not true since private charities were able to do so for over a hundred years before the government got involved. The government hates competition."
    In post #452 (Is Taxation Slavery?) you replied, "No because it does not address the real question. Yes there have been examples of philanthropy throughout time, what I want to see is that if it is enough to take care of everyone in need."
    do you disagree that not taking care of everyone in need is a rephrasing of
    Quote Originally Posted by LiberalAvenger View Post
    Unfortunately, private charities can not keep up with the needs of the f financially handicapped.
    . If you disagree, please tell me how they are different.

    If you misunderstood, I will restrict the scope of my restatement to the realm of finances. However, both statements pretty much mean the same thing.

    Also per post 461, I did admit my error here http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls/...post1058858632

    Then I posted this http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls/...post1058858690 about the existance of poor houses (which wouldn't have been necessary if charities were taking care of the poor as an alternative proof, which you did not address, except to state that it was a state issue vs a federal one, which was outside the scope of our primary conversation about you backing up your claim.

    Also, please do not play game with me and equivocate me and yourstar. She has her arguments, I have mine. This is not some sport with two opposing sides. This is a bunch of individuals, each with their own point of view.

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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    In post #445 I stated, "Not true since private charities were able to do so for over a hundred years before the government got involved. The government hates competition."

    In post #446 Your Star replied with, "Private charities don't have the reliability of the government. They can be there for you one month, but not the next. The government won't do that."

    In post #447 you replied to my argument, "Do you have any data to support this assertion?"

    In post #448 Your Star asserted, "Your over exaggerating the effectiveness of those charities. Before welfare programs it was quite literally do or die."

    I responded to it in post #449#449, "Will this suffice?" with a link to the Philanthropic Society's history section.

    In post #452 you replied, "No because it does not address the real question. Yes there have been examples of philanthropy throughout time, what I want to see is that if it is enough to take care of everyone in need."

    You moved the goal post there since that was never my argument, but Your Star's.

    In post #461 you moved the goal posts again by using an invalid comparison to prove that charity was ineffective and reliable from 1700-1919 by posting up an article about prostitution during the 19th century. In post #471 you demanded I back up my position with data and I did on the argument I made originally. Afterthat, you have misattributed Your Star's argument to me. By doing so you have moved the goal post again by letting Your Star slide on not providing proof of her argument and moving it onto me.

    Since Your Star and you have failed to provide any proof that charity was unreliable and ineffective, I did not need to provide proof of my own under the rules of debate. You and her both used rhetoric and opinion, so I replied in kind with opinion.
    You seem to be taking things out of context.

    Your “statement” of:
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    Not true since private charities were able to do so for over a hundred years before the government got involved. The government hates competition.
    Was actually a response to LiberalAvenger’s response to a previous post, namely:
    Quote Originally Posted by LiberalAvenger View Post
    That sounds good on paper. Unfortunately, private charities cannot keep up with the needs of the f financially handicapped.
    In that context, it’s obvious why megaprogman would think you were claiming the opposite, and further, claiming that history showed this… Thus, why he expected you to prove such.
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    ^^^ Um, I never said that charities didn't exist, or helped.. I stated that you can't rely on charities, as you can the government. Because charities don't have a permanent source of income, the way the government has. If they don't get donations, they can't do anything for you, hence my comment they can be for you one month and not the next. Are you saying that a single charity has as good of income as the US government? I've been waiting for you to provide this info, yet you haven't.

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