View Poll Results: Is Taxation Slavery?

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  • Yes

    18 17.14%
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    78 74.29%
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Thread: Is Taxation Slavery?

  1. #411
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    You know what that tells me? It tells me the federal government is spending trillions of dollars that it has no authority in the Constitution to spend. Cut out the unconstitutional programs and the original system put in the Constitution would work. I say it would work, because the United States had paid off every debt it incurred during the War of Independence and operated in the black. This is also why there is a clause in the Constitution that guarantees that the debts the states incurred from the war and until the ratification of the Constitution. I give you Article VI Clause I.

    All Debts contracted and Engagements entered into, before the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be as valid against the United States under this Constitution, as under the Confederation.
    There are very few government programs spent by the federal government that are unconstitutional, and hardly in the trillions.

  2. #412
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    You know what that tells me? It tells me the federal government is spending trillions of dollars that it has no authority in the Constitution to spend. Cut out the unconstitutional programs and the original system put in the Constitution would work. I say it would work, because the United States had paid off every debt it incurred during the War of Independence and operated in the black. This is also why there is a clause in the Constitution that guarantees that the debts the states incurred from the war and until the ratification of the Constitution. I give you Article VI Clause I.

    All Debts contracted and Engagements entered into, before the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be as valid against the United States under this Constitution, as under the Confederation.
    we would be better if we all had far more money to spend and the government had far less to spend

    of course such a scenario keeps dem politicians out of power and unable to make class warfare advocates feel better



  3. #413
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    You should pay taxes proportionate to your income. Lets say the tax rate is 20%, and like you want it is the same for all citizens. The person making $500,00 will pay $100,000 in taxes, barring any deductions. A substantial amount, but it doesn't hinder the person making $500,000 as much as it hinders the person making $15,000 who will pay $3,000. Because the person making $15,000 is more likely to spend all of that money, maybe even more spending on just the basic needs to live. Like shelter, food, clothes, transportation, electricity, water,etc. While the person making $500,000 doesn't have that problem. So I ask the question, why do you want to take money from the less fortunate? Like were on food stamps because we want to be on them.
    why? what good do I get by being forced to spend money on people who cannot hack it on their own.

    I am not taking money from you anymore than Roger Federer takes prize money from guys who cannot return his serve. I compete, you compete, in nature, people like you don't survive. nature is a cruel master and when we ignore it, we often have problems--isn't that what the left wing tree huggers tell us?

    really you haven't given me a valid reason why I should be taxed to pay for your existence. Your life is not my fault-your predicament is not caused by me. So why should I have to solve your problems?



  4. #414
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    There are very few government programs spent by the federal government that are unconstitutional, and hardly in the trillions.
    in reality almost all the new deal and great society programs are unconstitutional. the new deal's first schemes were struck down before FDR threatened to pack the court. funny how dems didn't like stare decisis back then



  5. #415
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    There are very few government programs spent by the federal government that are unconstitutional, and hardly in the trillions.
    Anything that is spent beyond what is listed in Article I Section VIII Clauses II-XVII is unconstitutional. That's how it goes so yes those are unconstitutional.

  6. #416
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Ferris View Post
    So apparently your argument is that the state has the right to violate the non-aggression principle and infringe upon the individuals right to self ownership because the state HAS to violate the non-aggression principle and infringe upon the individuals right of self ownership to continue to function. Well that's kind of the whole point, the state is an illegitimate entity which has to by its very nature enslave the populace through illegitimate actions in order to continue its survival.
    But the survival of the government is related to the survival of the populace. Therefore, the survival of the government is dependent on the survival of the populace. Therefore, it is in the best interests of the government to provide collective security and defense for the populace. Such security and defense is not slavery.

    And trust me, the rights of individuals would not be far less respected in an anarchy without a government.

  7. #417
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    You should pay taxes proportionate to your income. Lets say the tax rate is 20%, and like you want it is the same for all citizens. The person making $500,00 will pay $100,000 in taxes, barring any deductions. A substantial amount, but it doesn't hinder the person making $500,000 as much as it hinders the person making $15,000 who will pay $3,000. Because the person making $15,000 is more likely to spend all of that money, maybe even more spending on just the basic needs to live. Like shelter, food, clothes, transportation, electricity, water,etc. While the person making $500,000 doesn't have that problem. So I ask the question, why do you want to take money from the less fortunate? Like were on food stamps because we want to be on them.
    Switch out the money for say the use of your house. Would you say the same thing?

  8. #418
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    Anything that is spent beyond what is listed in Article I Section VIII Clauses II-XVII is unconstitutional. That's how it goes so yes those are unconstitutional.
    Thank you for the very detailed response about exactly which government spending is and isn't unconstutitional. Thanks for listing the numerous programs and examples of unconstutitional spending. It goes very far to prove your points.

  9. #419
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    You should pay taxes proportionate to your income. Lets say the tax rate is 20%, and like you want it is the same for all citizens. The person making $500,00 will pay $100,000 in taxes, barring any deductions. A substantial amount, but it doesn't hinder the person making $500,000 as much as it hinders the person making $15,000 who will pay $3,000. Because the person making $15,000 is more likely to spend all of that money, maybe even more spending on just the basic needs to live. Like shelter, food, clothes, transportation, electricity, water,etc. While the person making $500,000 doesn't have that problem. So I ask the question, why do you want to take money from the less fortunate? Like were on food stamps because we want to be on them.
    you buying anything "hinders" you more than it does me. So what. that is an incentive for you to work harder and smarter and to delay gratification. I didn't get married until I was through grad and law school and had a successful practice. When I went back to my 25th reunion I thought very few people would have a child as young as my only son-8. Rather that was common. These high achievers waited until they were established in their careers before having children. It is amazing how many poor people were having children when I was having cram sessions or study groups

    BTW if I pay 100K in taxes and you pay 3000 I am paying 30X more than you and I certainly am not getting 30 times the services. Indeed you use more tax dollars than I do since I am paying for people like you and I use very little federal services.



  10. #420
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    Re: Is Taxation Slavery?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    But the survival of the government is related to the survival of the populace. Therefore, the survival of the government is dependent on the survival of the populace. Therefore, it is in the best interests of the government to provide collective security and defense for the populace. Such security and defense is not slavery.

    And trust me, the rights of individuals would not be far less respected in an anarchy without a government.
    Ask the people, like the survivors of Waco and Ruby Ridge, if their rights were respected by the government.

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