View Poll Results: Which tax system is most 'fair'?

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  • Progressive Tax

    90 42.25%
  • Regressive Tax

    0 0%
  • Flat Percentage Tax Rate

    104 48.83%
  • Flat Dollar Tax

    5 2.35%
  • Other

    14 6.57%
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Thread: Which tax system is most 'fair'

  1. #51
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Which tax system is most 'fair'

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post
    I think it is so funny how people think a transaction tax is somehow voluntary.

    So, what if, instead of taxing income they taxed transactions only. All transactions. Including those that go on between and employer and employees. Like the transaction that occurs when an employee gets paid for work services rendered.

    Would that make ya'll feel better about the income tax? If it was a tax levied on employers for the voluntary transaction they engage in when they pay employees?
    I have consistently noted why I oppose progressive tax rates

    those in a lower bracket should not be able to vote up-by sheer numbers-the rates of those in higher brackets

    everyone should lose the same percentage of each additional dollar they make with a tax increase.



  2. #52
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    Re: Which tax system is most 'fair'

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post
    I don't view property rights as absolute, but rather I view limited property rights as a mechanism to create incentives for a nation's people to become productive. In other words, property rights exist not to protect the rights of the individual, but rather to serve society. The mistake many people make is to view them as serving the individual, and then start to mistakenly believe that they are somehow absolute. No rights are absolute. They all only exist as long as they serve the purpose of increasing the good in a free society.

    Since I don't view taxation as theft, I am free to recommend that tax system which best serves a nation. I don't really care about fairness, since there are so many ways to look at such a notion. The only thing that really matters is that tax system which maximizes both prosperity and spread of the nation's wealth. Sometimes these are in conflict and it is up to society to determine the correct balance. However, just the maximization of prosperity itself is best served by a progressive tax system.

    Any time society attempts a system of property rights and combines it with any tax system that gives rise to a pronounced concentration of a nation's wealth in the hands of a relatively few, this leads to economic malaise, corruption and poverty for the vast majority of the population. I like my society set up with a set of fairly strong and extensive property rights to foster a free market system, combined with wise regulation of those markets, and finally combined with a progressive tax system to offset the tendency of wealth to accumulate at the top.

    This kind of system is a whole package, and it is "Fair" because it works. If a flat tax was what "worked", I would be for that (in emerging economies, there is evidence that a flat tax is best). Whatever works.
    So in other words you support collective tyranny and mob rule. So long as the gang of men is large enough you will justify outright theft.
    Last edited by Agent Ferris; 07-11-10 at 12:08 AM.

  3. #53
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    Re: Which tax system is most 'fair'

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post
    I think it is so funny how people think a transaction tax is somehow voluntary.

    So, what if, instead of taxing income they taxed transactions only. All transactions. Including those that go on between and employer and employees. Like the transaction that occurs when an employee gets paid for work services rendered.

    Would that make ya'll feel better about the income tax? If it was a tax levied on employers for the voluntary transaction they engage in when they pay employees?
    The income tax would be better implemented if most credits and exemptions were removed and if FICA/Medicare tax were included with your regular tax rates.

    The system needs to be simplified and it's complexity only benefits (what I think are) fraudulent tax prep companies.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  4. #54
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    Re: Which tax system is most 'fair'

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    I have consistently noted why I oppose progressive tax rates

    those in a lower bracket should not be able to vote up-by sheer numbers-the rates of those in higher brackets

    everyone should lose the same percentage of each additional dollar they make with a tax increase.
    Which doesn't address the issue that the income tax could be made into a voluntary tax simply by making it a tax on the employer on the transaction they perform when they pay someone for work.
    You can never be safe from a government that can keep you completely safe from each other and the world. You must choose.

  5. #55
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Which tax system is most 'fair'

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post
    Which doesn't address the issue that the income tax could be made into a voluntary tax simply by making it a tax on the employer on the transaction they perform when they pay someone for work.

    that would eliminate progressive tax rates-that would be a flat rate as sales taxes are.

    the tax on a million dollar transaction is say 7% in Ohio just as a 10 dollar one

    works for me



  6. #56
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    Re: Which tax system is most 'fair'

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post
    Which doesn't address the issue that the income tax could be made into a voluntary tax simply by making it a tax on the employer on the transaction they perform when they pay someone for work.
    We could even make it more fun and do some crazy things, since this tax is voluntary. Like, tax lower wage jobs at a higher tax rate to give employers an incentive to pay higher wages. It could be structured to make it desirable for employers to pay better. No need for minimum wage anymore!! This is a tax libertarians should love!! I can also see some ways to structure it so that it is progressive and accomplishes additional necessary redistribution of wealth.

    All on a voluntary basis!!
    You can never be safe from a government that can keep you completely safe from each other and the world. You must choose.

  7. #57
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    Re: Which tax system is most 'fair'

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    that would eliminate progressive tax rates-that would be a flat rate as sales taxes are.

    the tax on a million dollar transaction is say 7% in Ohio just as a 10 dollar one

    works for me
    Oh, no no no Since it is voluntary whether it's progressive or not, it gets to be progressive
    You can never be safe from a government that can keep you completely safe from each other and the world. You must choose.

  8. #58
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    Re: Which tax system is most 'fair'

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post
    We could even make it more fun and do some crazy things, since this tax is voluntary. Like, tax lower wage jobs at a higher tax rate to give employers an incentive to pay higher wages. It could be structured to make it desirable for employers to pay better. No need for minimum wage anymore!! This is a tax libertarians should love!! I can also see some ways to structure it so that it is progressive and accomplishes additional necessary redistribution of wealth.

    All on a voluntary basis!!
    we ought to have a real voluntary tax system

    it would kill of those who live off the taxes of others rather quickly

    that's what I love about a consumption tax-if you are frugal and want to increase your wealth, you don't buy a new car every year or the newest and greatest droid phone the minute it comes out

    the current tax system-the pandering progressive tax and the death confiscation tax-both punish thrift and frugality



  9. #59
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    Re: Which tax system is most 'fair'

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    a consumption tax has dozens of benefits for us who dont like an intrusive government
    Unless you're the one remitting the taxes. To actually produce an accurate fair consumption tax, we'd need to expand the IRS at least three fold to run the necessary inventory audits to ensure compliance. We'd also need to effectively turn the credit card companies into Big Brother entities to ensure credit sales are being properly accounted for as well. When business realizes they are literally going to have a full time government auditor in their office, they will rebel against a consumption tax.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  10. #60
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    Re: Which tax system is most 'fair'

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    we ought to have a real voluntary tax system

    it would kill of those who live off the taxes of others rather quickly

    that's what I love about a consumption tax-if you are frugal and want to increase your wealth, you don't buy a new car every year or the newest and greatest droid phone the minute it comes out

    the current tax system-the pandering progressive tax and the death confiscation tax-both punish thrift and frugality
    The notion of a tax on employers for labor transactions is entirely a voluntary tax. period. People don't have to engage in business if they don't want to pay it.
    You can never be safe from a government that can keep you completely safe from each other and the world. You must choose.

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