View Poll Results: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

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  • yes, the democrats need more money to spend

    20 40.82%
  • No, I want to keep my own money

    29 59.18%
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Thread: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

  1. #141
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    Thanks for playing the straight man here!

    1) your social security tax rate is 7.65%, not 15.4 (the other amount is an employer tax... paid entirely by the employer, it ain't your money) I am employer. I pay these taxes, my employees do not. I set their salaries at market, this additional tax is over and above that salary.
    2) the 17% tax on federal income is on your TAXABLE income, not what you earned. Assuming you are single and do not itemize, you have a $5700 standard deduction and $3650 exemption, that is $9,350 of your income for which is exempt from Federal Income (and usually state income taxes). So, if your taxable income was $50,000, let me assume you had a salary of 59,350.... Hence you had an effective rate of 14%.
    3) If you itemized, you would be deducting your CA income tax on your federal return, hence you effective callifornia rate would be 5% * (1-25%) or 3.75%, but you did not itemize, so we will count the California rate at 5%...except, again its not on the whole income, so call it 4%
    4) Sales tax. The only way you paid 9% in sales tax is if you spend every penny on consumable goods and did not eat or have a roof over you head. We know that was not the case. Likely only 20% of your income went for goods subject to sales tax, but lets' call it 30% to cover your fuel and phone ... so you paid 9% on $17,800 this rounds up to 3% of your income
    5) Property taxes. Don't complain here, you don't itemize so you don't have property and property taxes. If you did, your income tax bill would have been lower
    6) Registration fees - are fees, that is their nature... to apply the incident to the user. Don't call them taxes
    7) Petty withholding taxes - I don't know what this is, so I will credit this to your account

    OK... shall we: 7.65+14+4+3+2= 30.65% (including all of your miscellaneous items, which you did not include)

    Thus proving my point, there is a general lack of understanding of how taxes work. People that just want to add one tax on top of another and work themselves into a frenzy with a bad conclusion and giving themselves undo heartburn.
    Why is it those who don't make enough to be soaked continually claim that those of us who do don't understand our taxes

    my rates next year will include 8% ohio income taxes. 39.6% federal income taxes. Sales taxes of 7% in my county. Property taxes-cannot tell (thank God I live on a farm or they would be 30,000 a year), gasoline taxes-my wife and I drive about 34K miles a year,

    I am a competitive shooter so I pay the R-P excise tax on guns and ammunition, I also am a coach of archers and my entire family shoots on the national circuit so we pay lots of hotel taxes etc. The Robinson-Pittman tax is 11% and since shooting sports is my main use of discretionary income after my son's private schoool tuition, I am paying a ton of taxes most people don't. Of course I get soaked by SS "taxes" and those are going up as well.

    next year I will keep less than half of every additional dollar I earn.



  2. #142
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    Re: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    lenin called such people USEFUL FOOLS or USEFUL IDIOTS.
    Useful idiot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    The term is commonly attributed to Lenin and Stalin, sometimes in the form "useful idiots of the West", to describe those Western reporters and travelers who would endorse the Soviet Union and its policies in the West. In fact, the earliest known usage is in a 1948 New York Times article on Italian politics. [1] In 1987, Grant Harris, senior reference librarian at the Library of Congress, said "We have not been able to identify this phrase [useful idiots of the West] among [Lenin's] published works."[2] [3].
    Amazon.com: They Never Said It: A Book of Fake Quotes, Misquotes, and Misleading Attributions (9780195064698): Paul F.…

    24 of 28 people found the following review helpful:
    5.0 out of 5 stars Spoiling a good story, March 21, 2003
    By Andrew S. Rogers (Stamford, Connecticut) - See all my reviews
    (TOP 500 REVIEWER) (REAL NAME) (VINE VOICE)
    This review is from: They Never Said It: A Book of Fake Quotes, Misquotes, and Misleading Attributions (Hardcover)
    It may well be true, as Roy Howard never said (p. 51) that "too much fact checking has ruined many a good news story." But the many misquotations listed here, some very well known, often have fascinating stories in themselves. In a day when, thanks to the Internet, misquotations, urban legends, and dubious "facts" fly faster and farther than ever, this book is a very valuable resource to have around.

    My major complaint with this book is that I wish it had been much longer -- for example, there are numerous quotes attributed to Winston Churchill (like the one about being a liberal when you're 25) that could stand to be debunked alongside the two included in this volume.

    Still, though, it's very helpful to be able to demonstrate to folks that Lenin never said anything about "useful idiots" (p. 76), that Lincoln never made the long statement beginning, "You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift..." (p. 82), or that Voltaire never "defend[ed] to the death your right to say it" (p. 124). For those reasons alone, I would recommend this book be kept and studied by anyone who cares about truth, accuracy, and stomping urban legends to the death they deserve.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  3. #143
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    Re: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    estate taxes were a scheme for social engineering based on the absence of a progressive income tax of any consequence. If you lose 50% of what you earn to taxes WTF should you lose another 50% upon death. Heirs to a fortune certainly did more to earn it than greedy politicians who use the estate tax to gain votes from the spiteful and the envious
    Estate taxes effect fewer than 5,500 estates in America on an annual basis. That's approximately .003% of Americans. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/09/bu.../09estate.html

    So, I'm glad that you support the Paris Hilton tax cut at the expense of hardworking Americans.

    Paris thanks you for your support.

  4. #144
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    Re: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    this is beyond stupid.

    an increase of the tax rate from 35% to 39.5% means those of use in the top bracket are sure going to pay alot more than 4.5% more taxes. ANyone who has dividend income is going to being paying almost 40% on that rather than 15%
    Inaccurate. You would only pay 4.5% more on the income above the threshold. That's how our system works. Even when the highest rate was 90%, it didn't mean that the uber-wealthy paid 90% of ALL of their income. They paid 90% of the income above the highest amount.

    To state otherwise is to perpetrate a lie the rich have been telling for decades. If it were true that the wealthy paid 90% of their entire income, there would've been no wealthy people during that time at all. And despite ginormous tax rates (which, by the way, I'm not arguing to go back to 90%, so please don't twist my words) there were still plenty of wealthy people during that time period.

  5. #145
    Sporadic insanity normal.


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    Re: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

    Don' wanna read thread.

    So.

    In general, I support all tax breaks/reductions/cuts, and oppose all tax increases, no matter the method used.

    As another general rule, I support budget cuts in concert with tax cuts, as such only seems reasonable.

    So, I do NOT think the "bush tax cuts" should be cancled.



    Then again, I would probably support restructuring the entire US tax system and code...
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  6. #146
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    Estate taxes effect fewer than 5,500 estates in America on an annual basis. That's approximately .003% of Americans. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/09/bu.../09estate.html

    So, I'm glad that you support the Paris Hilton tax cut at the expense of hardworking Americans.

    Paris thanks you for your support.

    HOw many Japanese were put in camps in WWII? Injustice is not excused because the number of victims are small.

    why are you entitled to Paris Hilton's wealth? You did nothing to earn it so what makes you think you should share in it

    do you think everyone who is wealthy should be taxed until all the poor are not poor?



  7. #147
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    Inaccurate. You would only pay 4.5% more on the income above the threshold. That's how our system works. Even when the highest rate was 90%, it didn't mean that the uber-wealthy paid 90% of ALL of their income. They paid 90% of the income above the highest amount.

    To state otherwise is to perpetrate a lie the rich have been telling for decades. If it were true that the wealthy paid 90% of their entire income, there would've been no wealthy people during that time at all. And despite ginormous tax rates (which, by the way, I'm not arguing to go back to 90%, so please don't twist my words) there were still plenty of wealthy people during that time period.
    You are lying

    if you have a tax rate of 30% that means you pay 30 dollars on every 100 you make after hitting that bracket

    if your taxes go to 33% that means you pay 33 Dollars on ever 100 you make after that bracket

    30 dollars to 33 dollars is MORE THAN A THREE PERCENT INCREASE IN YOUR TAXES

    given dividend income taxes are more than doubling I will be paying far more than what you claim as well and almost everyone who is in the top bracket has income from dividends

    you are the liar, not me.

    and why should I pay a higher rate than you-I still would pay more in taxes and I certainly don't use as much as most of the low bracket payers. I don't use the emergency room for health care. I don't live in an area that constantly requires police attention. My family isn't engaged in criminal activity requiring the court system. My son goes to a private school even though I pay far more in property taxes than all but a few people in my city given I am one of the three largest individual landowners. I don't get any sort of welfare.



  8. #148
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    Estate taxes effect fewer than 5,500 estates in America on an annual basis. That's approximately .003% of Americans. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/09/bu.../09estate.html

    So, I'm glad that you support the Paris Hilton tax cut at the expense of hardworking Americans.

    Paris thanks you for your support.
    BTW you are wrong. Just because only 5500 estates pay an estate tax far more are affected by it. Bill gates and Warren BUffett's estates won't be affected because they are donating their wealth so the government gets nothing. Every estate that has had to create trusts, hire attorneys, or willed assets to charity or paid gift taxes while the estate holder is alive in order to avoid the estate tax have been affected by the death confiscation tax. and only someone who is clueless about this area of the law would think that there are only 5500 estates a year that use such services.



  9. #149
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    Re: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

    To the OP, I have no problem with the tax rates returning to their previous amounts for the wealthy.

  10. #150
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Should the Bush tax cuts be cancelled next year as Obama wants to do?

    Quote Originally Posted by CompSciGuy View Post
    To the OP, I have no problem with the tax rates returning to their previous amounts for the wealthy.
    I wonder what your tax rates are. I suspect you are a perfect example of the main problem of progressive taxes.

    You have no problem with jacking up taxes on other people as long as you don't have to pay more and as long as you continue to get the same level of handouts you expect.



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