View Poll Results: What is the duty of our Government?

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  • To define and protect our fundamental rights

    11 68.75%
  • #1 and to define and provide additional privelages

    5 31.25%
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Thread: Define the Government's duty to the people?

  1. #11
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    Re: Define the Government's duty to the people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    It's mostly A, a little B. The main purpose of the government is to protect and proliferate the rights and liberties of the individual. Now times change, yes? Technologies improve, society becomes more complex, to protect those rights the government may have to act in various ways. It's a delicate balancing act in reality. There is necessity for government, we cannot get away from that. Anarchy does not work. Thus that means there are legitimate and necessary places for government to act. Those places may not be static, and indeed as the aggregated society gets more complex those places will not remain static. To continue to protect and proliferate the rights and liberties of the individual what the government does may have to change. Too much government is bad, which is why this becomes so very delicate. But there are proper roles of regulation and oversight which the government can partake in to ensure the free practice of our rights. The Constitution not only lays out the powers of government, but also the purpose of government. And the government can use those granted powers to fulfill its purpose. Nothing is ever static, there is no such thing as infinity. To continue to do its job to the people, how the government acts will change over time. We just have to be careful and ensure that it changes in the right way and in a way which abides by our rights and liberties.
    Very well said and point well taken. I suppose what I'm trying to get a general sense of is, though the types of laws they need to pass will change due to times changing, what should be the intent of those laws? To uphold the fundamental rights? Or to uphold what the majority feels is 'best' for society in granting additional privelages beyond those fundamental rights?

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    Re: Define the Government's duty to the people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    The government goes about it by creating laws that promote the health and wellbeing of the country.
    I'm not trying to be a smart***, but sincerely would like to ask: are you a politician?

    I agree with you. Again, my question is: how? Under what intent do they make their laws? To do what is best for the people via granting privelages? Should it be within their power to force people to pay for privelages for other people, for the benefit of the whole?

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    Re: Define the Government's duty to the people?

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertz View Post
    I'm not trying to be a smart***, but sincerely would like to ask: are you a politician?

    I agree with you. Again, my question is: how? Under what intent do they make their laws? To do what is best for the people via granting privelages? Should it be within their power to force people to pay for privelages for other people, for the benefit of the whole?
    See, you are asking loaded questions, which is why you are not getting the answer you want. It's a privilege that you drive on roads that you did not pay for, have police and fire protection from people whose salary you do not pay. It's a privilege to be protected from foreign countries by people you have not paid for. When you say privilege, you are trying to make a point, but it does not work.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham
    Iíve always believed that America is an idea, not defined by its people but by its ideals. - Lindsey Graham

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    Re: Define the Government's duty to the people?

    The Preamble:
    We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

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    Re: Define the Government's duty to the people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    See, you are asking loaded questions, which is why you are not getting the answer you want. It's a privilege that you drive on roads that you did not pay for, have police and fire protection from people whose salary you do not pay. It's a privilege to be protected from foreign countries by people you have not paid for. When you say privilege, you are trying to make a point, but it does not work.
    No. you're making an assumption. So let me clarify: I'm not making trying to make a point. I am asking questions. And I believe you may have finally answered it. All of those things you listed are privelages. Assuming you support those privelages, then you would choose the second option. I'm not trying to trap you or debate you. I understand 'why' you feel that way. I personally would prefer each of those things to be in the private sector (except national security) or in more local or state govt's hands - but not in the federal govt's IMO. But I didn't create the poll to debate this. We each have our own beliefs.

    I'm just curious how many people agree with you (assuming I'm right about your belief) and how many agree with me. hence the poll. It is a loaded question, but it's the starting point. Before we debate a topic like healthcare in our gov't, we first need to decide if it's even something that should be debated at the national level. Is that what we intend our government to do?

    I just never understand why we debate these topics that are irrelevant, IMO, at the national level.

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    Re: Define the Government's duty to the people?

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    The Preamble:
    Yes. That is what the preamble says. So what do YOU say? How do we do that? by protecting these things listed without providing additional privelages - let that up to the people themselves? Is that possible? Or do you think we should provide privelages beyond those that directly support and protect the fundamental rights? Should the state directly provide more than these rights or to merely provide the opportunity?

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    Re: Define the Government's duty to the people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    See, you are asking loaded questions, which is why you are not getting the answer you want. It's a privilege that you drive on roads that you did not pay for, have police and fire protection from people whose salary you do not pay. It's a privilege to be protected from foreign countries by people you have not paid for. When you say privilege, you are trying to make a point, but it does not work.
    What do you mean? I've paid for all that crap. None of it could exist without the taxpayers. I pay for roads, emergency services, parks, forests, etc. Is it still privlege or is it my property?
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Define the Government's duty to the people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    What do you mean? I've paid for all that crap. None of it could exist without the taxpayers. I pay for roads, emergency services, parks, forests, etc. Is it still privlege or is it my property?
    I actually missed that point he was trying to make - that we get these 'privelages' without paying for it. Now I'm truly confused as to what he is driving at. I don't think it matters because his point actually answers my question and so I'm happy. But I'd love to hear the explanation.

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    Re: Define the Government's duty to the people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    What do you mean? I've paid for all that crap. None of it could exist without the taxpayers. I pay for roads, emergency services, parks, forests, etc. Is it still privlege or is it my property?
    You paid for a very small portion of them. And yet you benefit from them in full.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham
    Iíve always believed that America is an idea, not defined by its people but by its ideals. - Lindsey Graham

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    Re: Define the Government's duty to the people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    You paid for a very small portion of them. And yet you benefit from them in full.
    But I did pay, it's part of the aggregation ability of the government. They can collect "small" amounts of money from a large population and then use that money for something. Be it the military, the roads, etc. But it does require that we all pay. We aren't simply given these things, we have to pay for all those things. Nothing is free.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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