View Poll Results: Experimenting with Education

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  • Good Idea

    11 37.93%
  • Bad Idea

    10 34.48%
  • "other" Idea

    4 13.79%
  • Ethical

    6 20.69%
  • Not Ethical

    5 17.24%
  • "other" ethical

    4 13.79%
  • Other

    5 17.24%
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    8 27.59%
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Thread: Education Experimentation

  1. #41
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    Re: Education Experimentation

    Quote Originally Posted by Psychoclown View Post
    But here is a guy who is trying to find creative solutions that are cost effective and you immediately reject him on some vague idealistic basis that "kids should love learning" or "they should be doing this anyway".
    The reason I reject his ideas because those kids may turn into adults who think they should get something extra like cash or some sort of other bonus for something that they should already be doing. It has nothing to do with loving to learn. I hated school but I still made As and Bs on my report card.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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  2. #42
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    Re: Education Experimentation

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The reason I reject his ideas because those kids may turn into adults who think they should get something extra like cash or some sort of other bonus for something that they should already be doing. It has nothing to do with loving to learn. I hated school but I still made As and Bs on my report card.
    Some companies give bonuses for perfect attendance or achieving certain goals through hard work or achieving certain safety goals (X number of days without an accident). But shouldn't workers already be coming into work regularly, working safely, and giving their best effort? Why are we rewarding people for doing what they should already be doing?

    Because rewards are an effective motivator and they get results.
    Slipping into madness is good for the sake of comparison - Unknown.

  3. #43
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    Re: Education Experimentation

    I think the key is to actually get the students interested in their studies.

    The monetary reward route does that to an extent.

    But the true goal should be to get every single student interested to the point that they seek out more info on their own, without any incentives other than the desire to know more.

    Such a goal will likely never be fully realized, but it should still be the goal, IMO.
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  4. #44
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    Re: Education Experimentation

    A change has to start somewhere.

    The school that he discussed which had crack vials on the ground outside - think of all the many reasons why those kids weren't doing well, make a list.

    Parent's weren't encouraging of it
    Parent's weren't involved at all
    Children didn't see the reason
    Their friends didn't do it, why should they?
    They're told to go to school by adults - so - it's exactly what some of them don't want to do.
    Even if they do want to change, how do they do it? They don't know, they're kids, they don't have the answers.
    If their teachers, principle and community leaders don't have the answers then who does?
    If Mom and Dad aren't encouraging, if their friends aren't encouraging and their teachers are at the end of their rope - how do you change everything?

    It's not only *right now, this one year of students* that needs to change - that change needs to stick with them . . . so they, then, can be different in school and also in life after school. That change needs to stick with them so they can then take more care and passion in their children's education - and on and on.

    The change has to start somewhere. Since the kids in this program were mostly underprivileged and disadvantaged then I think they need GREAT role models and GREAT leaders - people who DO give a ****. Just *wanting* Mom and dad to be involved won't actually make Mom and Dad want ot be involved. Just *wanting* students to *want* to do better in school won't make them do better.

    This is part of the reason why I'm a bit pleased that Obama is there as an example - Mom, Dad, Uncle, Sister - if these fundamental people in a child's life aren't THERE to guide, encourage and support then someone needs to be.
    Last edited by Aunt Spiker; 06-17-10 at 05:30 PM.
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  5. #45
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    Re: Education Experimentation

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The reason I reject his ideas because those kids may turn into adults who think they should get something extra like cash or some sort of other bonus for something that they should already be doing. It has nothing to do with loving to learn. I hated school but I still made As and Bs on my report card.
    I would compare it more to them turning into adults who think they should get cash for working. To me that sounds like having a job.

    I agree with the other poster who used an example of bonuses at work for performance.
    We just hit a 1 year with no OSHA at work and we are all getting something extra on our paychecks. Obviously people should work safely due to a desire for self preservation, but it has been shown over and over that a little carrot goes a long way.
    Last edited by tacomancer; 06-17-10 at 07:47 PM.

  6. #46
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    Re: Education Experimentation

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    It's a bad idea, an education should be treasured, and made the most of. Not something that kids do only to make a quick buck.
    And yet this is precisely why Parents and Teachers exhort the pupils to do better at school.

    So that they will pass the tests and this will enable them to get into a decent University or college at the end of which they will hopefully get a good degree, and with this degree get a good job, that will pay more than the job they might have had if they ignored education.

  7. #47
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    Re: Education Experimentation

    I agree with the experimenting with education.
    But, after several years, if the results are obvious, then quick action should be taken. Is this not the reason for our federal level dept. of education?
    Some ideas are so bad that they should be stopped on paper.
    Many nations do this, we should learn from them as to what works and what does not.

  8. #48
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    Re: Education Experimentation

    Quote Originally Posted by Jucon View Post
    We get money, raises, bonuses, and time off based off of the quality of our work at jobs. I think paying / rewarding kids to do well in school would more closely simulate what the real world is like. Like I said, grades alone aren't a good enough motivator for some.
    IMO, we over-reward those with bonuses,raises,time off on the job..
    Where is the satisfaction from simply doing things correctly?
    Education and work are two different things and should be treated as such...

  9. #49
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    Re: Education Experimentation

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm View Post
    IMO, we over-reward those with bonuses,raises,time off on the job..
    Where is the satisfaction from simply doing things correctly?
    Education and work are two different things and should be treated as such...
    Companies don't provide bonuses, rewards, and incentive programs out of the goodness of their hearts. They do it because it provides results that far outweigh the costs of such rewards. It's a cost efficient method to raise productivity.

    Conservatives who argue for vouchers always say they want to apply the free market to education, which is fine. But why do they reject methods that have been proven in a free market setting to be cost effective ways of improving results? Bottom line is if paying kids to read a book results in them getting a better education and thus being better equipped to be productive members of society, isn't that the result we want? I fail to see how this means is so offensive that it doesn't justify the very positive ends that everyone claims to strive for.
    Slipping into madness is good for the sake of comparison - Unknown.

  10. #50
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    Re: Education Experimentation

    The idea of paying children to get good grades strikes me as born of desperation rather than a desire for 'experimentation'.

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