View Poll Results: Could you go along with a plan akin to the below? (Pick party closest to you)

Voters
10. You may not vote on this poll
  • I'm a Republican, and yes I could

    2 20.00%
  • I'm a Republican, and no I coudn't

    0 0%
  • I'm a Democrat, and yes I could

    1 10.00%
  • I'm a Democrat, and no I couldn't

    0 0%
  • I'm a Centrist/Independent, and yes I could

    4 40.00%
  • I'm a Centrist/Independent, and no I couldn't

    1 10.00%
  • I'm a Libertarian, and yes I could

    1 10.00%
  • I'm a Libertarian, and no I couldn't

    0 0%
  • 42

    1 10.00%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Could you support a debt reduction plan like this?

  1. #11
    Count Smackula
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    Re: Could you support a debt reduction plan like this?

    Except what you're proposing is the exact opposite of what I am and is something that frankly will never likely happen, from what I'm understanding. Whether than attempting to finding a plan that can reach out to both sides by giving nods to both of thier suggested methods, you're simply throwing out a completely liberal focused plan where "spending goes up and taxes goes up" that's doomed to fail in regards to actually getting passed and having significant support of the people because it basically throws the middle finger to the other side, the exact thing the proposal outlined above is attempting to avoid by tieing both the notion of "we need to increase taxes" and "we need to cut spending" together and making them reliant on each other thus giving a higher chance that both will be done as the only other alternative is for neither to be done under that plan.
    My plan makes it possible for both parties to enact their brand of debt balancing. Democrats get higher taxes and lower spending, republicans get lower spending and lower taxes. Your plan provides incentives for the wrong behavior, overspending gets a tax cut, while fiscal responsibility results in higher taxes.

    I understand your concern about taxes skyrocketing to pay for absurd spending. However, you are discounting how unpopular increased taxation is. Our current level of spending is mostly based on the fact that we have completely divorced the idea of actually paying for our services and wars. Make the people feel a little pain every time they get more expenditures, and they will quickly become unwilling to support stuff they don't really really need.

  2. #12
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    Re: Could you support a debt reduction plan like this?

    Quote Originally Posted by ronpaulvoter View Post
    I disagree with most of this proposal.

    My top priority would be to CUT SPENDING.

    ....

    All well and good....but entirely unfeasible and utterly impossible to ever happen. Perhaps if the country was a monarchy you'd have a shot at this. As it is, your proposal of how to fix the issue would be as realistic as stating that ones proposal is to funnel our funds into creating a renewal resource that can enable fusion power to then sell it to all the countries we are in debt to for the elimination of the debt. If you're going for absolutely 100% impossible things with regards to the current climate why not at least go big?

    The purpose of my proposal was to suggest something relatively moderate enough and touching both sides ideal views enough to potentially have a legitimate chance, or at least a reasonable outside one, of actually being something possible in todays world rather than something completely and utterly ideologically based that has no actual foothold in that thing called reality.

  3. #13
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    Re: Could you support a debt reduction plan like this?

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    My plan makes it possible for both parties to enact their brand of debt balancing. Democrats get higher taxes and lower spending, republicans get lower spending and lower taxes. Your plan provides incentives for the wrong behavior, overspending gets a tax cut, while fiscal responsibility results in higher taxes.

    I understand your concern about taxes skyrocketing to pay for absurd spending. However, you are discounting how unpopular increased taxation is. Our current level of spending is mostly based on the fact that we have completely divorced the idea of actually paying for our services and wars. Make the people feel a little pain every time they get more expenditures, and they will quickly become unwilling to support stuff they don't really really need.
    Your issue would make complete and utter sense...if we were a direct democracy. If that was the case then you're absolutely right, we'd be providing a disincentive fiscal responsibility for what most people prefer for themselves (low taxes). However we're not a direct democracy, we're a representative republic. People in this country are getting more and more into the mindset that they want spending to be controlled AND they want to get rid of our debt. The problem is the political classes answer to this on the left is often is more and more taxes. The right is against taxes for the most part, but is almost as bad as the other side with regards to spending. What is a disincentive for a direct democracy is an INCENTIVE for the typical politician, as in regards to Democrats the hope is an extra tax is worth it to cut the budget, for Republicans a small extra tax is worth it to cut the budget, and for both the overwhelming desire by Americans for reduced spending and paying down the debt will make both parties hold to it.

    I disagree with your suggestion that taxes skyrocketing is unpopular. YOUR taxes skyrocketing is unpopular, however as the past few years various races have shown scape goating "other people" such as "The rich" in regards to taxes going up is not just unpopular but is something to even built a platform around.

  4. #14
    Count Smackula
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    Re: Could you support a debt reduction plan like this?

    People in this country are getting more and more into the mindset that they want spending to be controlled AND they want to get rid of our debt.
    I would fundamentally disagree with that statement. Voters may say they want controlled spending, but they refuse to accept that means cutting social security, medicare and defense. Politicians are doing what the electorate wants for once. It has gotten to the point where conservatives ended up championing medicare. Libertarians are the only group calling for meaningful cuts, but they lack the ability to win elections.

    I disagree with your suggestion that taxes skyrocketing is unpopular. YOUR taxes skyrocketing is unpopular, however as the past few years various races have shown scape goating "other people" such as "The rich" in regards to taxes going up is not just unpopular but is something to even built a platform around.
    The beauty of the sales tax you outlined is that it does hit the general public rather than shifting the burden elsewhere. Everyone would see the impact of their national spending habits every time they go the store.

  5. #15
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    Re: Could you support a debt reduction plan like this?

    Didn't scrutinize the details as closely as i should have. Concepts are good. But applying to reality suffers when we get to the core of the need. Which is spending cuts. SS and Medicare are the elephants in the room. And our Congress pricks are going to be resistant to touch anything that could or would impact their next re-election.

    The tragedy is that our nation is currently on an unsustainable path that requires leadership that can address a long term plan. But we continue to elect legislators that are consumed with the primary goal of simply holding on to power. Which by definition is a 2 or 6 year goal.

    The long term solution requires some short term pain and telling people things they don't want to hear. Just don't see Washington stepping up to that task anytime soon....






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