View Poll Results: What does redneck refer to

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  • It refers to a culture

    76 90.48%
  • It refers to a race

    8 9.52%
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Thread: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

  1. #341
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    Re: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    That's not what I asked and the Supreme Court lacks the delegated authority to decide constitutionality. It was a power they seized in Marburry v. Madison. I'll give you a hint... look in Article I Section X for stuff that is prohibited to the states.
    Again, as in Texas v, White, with Marbury v. Madison, just because you do not like the decision because it renders your position void, does not change the fact that it is legal precedence in dealing with legal issues.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
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  2. #342
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    Re: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    No, it wasn't. It was illegally seizing federal property and illegally seceding.
    See post #339 and it wasn't illegal to seize the property when Secretary of State Stanton was under orders from Lincoln to not accept any diplomats from the southern states.

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    See post #336.
    See post #339

    I'll give you a hint to look at Article I Section X to find what is prohibited to the states.

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Even if this is accurate. Beauregard fired on Fort Sumpter, illegally firing on a US military base.
    In defense of Charleston Harbor since at 1 AM a US Navy flotilla constisting of 2 sloops of war, a revenue cutter, and a troop steamer entered the harbor. That's an invasion of South Carolina's territorial waters.

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    The crux of your argument that secession was not illegal is false, and since your premise is false, everything that flows from it is.
    Declaring it false and proving it with the clauses from the Constitution of the United States is entirely different. If my argument is false then so was the argument used by those that attended the Hartford Convention in 1815 which many of the same arguments were used by the northern states.
    Last edited by The_Patriot; 06-11-10 at 04:23 AM.

  3. #343
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    Re: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Again, as in Texas v, White, with Marbury v. Madison, just because you do not like the decision because it renders your position void, does not change the fact that it is legal precedence in dealing with legal issues.
    The Tenth Amendment trumps stare decisis, so you were saying?

  4. #344
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    Re: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    The Articles of Confederation became null and void the moment the states were sent the Constitution to be ratified. The Congress of the Confederation ceased to exist as a governing body. The preamble of the Constitution is not law and neither is citing a paper written by the monarchist Hamilton, who was laughed and ridiculed out of the Philadelphia Convention. The only authority that is acceptable is Thomas Jefferson, the Anti-Federalists, and James Madison. They all disagree with you.
    Firstly, if you read my post carefully, you would have seen that I indicated that the Articles of Confederation were superseded by the Constitution. Secondly, Hamilton is far more credible than either Jefferson, Madison, or the Anti-Federalists. Hamilton wrote the bulk of the Federalist Papers, documents that are still used today in understanding what the framers thought during the Constitutional process.



    I already pointed out why it was wrong since there's nothing in the Constitution prohibiting the states from seceding. If Chase and the majority had actually adhered to the Constitution they would have rendered the entire war and the roughly 1 million dead pointless. He had no choice but to make a political decision to keep the war 'legal' (it wasn't a declared war as per the Constitution to begin with).
    And I already pointed out how the decision was reached, and whether you like it or not, it decreed that secession was illegal. Even Madison, in a letter to Daniel Webster during the nullification crisis, indicated that secession was "a violation, without cause, of a faith solemnly pledged." So, sorry. If you are going to base your entire position on the "secession is legal" argument, your position is lost, since it was not.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  5. #345
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    Re: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    The Tenth Amendment trumps stare decisis, so you were saying?
    I guess it doesn't since Texas v, White upheld the illegality of secession.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  6. #346
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    Re: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    See post #339 and it wasn't illegal to seize the property when Secretary of State Stanton was under orders from Lincoln to not accept any diplomats from the southern states.
    Post #339 has already been debunked.



    See post #339

    I'll give you a hint to look at Article I Section X to find what is prohibited to the states.
    I'll give you a hint, Texas v, White still stands, so I guess SCOTUS found that Article ! Section X did not apply.



    In defense of Charleston Harbor since at 1 AM a US Navy flotilla constisting of 2 sloops of war, a revenue cutter, and a troop steamer entered the harbor. That's an invasion of South Carolina's territorial waters.
    Since South Carolina was part of the US, as seceding was illegal, there was no invasion.



    Declaring it false and proving it with the clauses from the Constitution of the United States is entirely different. If my argument is false then so was the argument used by those that attended the Hartford Convention in 1815 which many of the same arguments were used by the northern states.
    Since the Hartford Convention did not actually result in any state attempting to secede, your point here is irrelevant.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  7. #347
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    Re: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Firstly, if you read my post carefully, you would have seen that I indicated that the Articles of Confederation were superseded by the Constitution. Secondly, Hamilton is far more credible than either Jefferson, Madison, or the Anti-Federalists. Hamilton wrote the bulk of the Federalist Papers, documents that are still used today in understanding what the framers thought during the Constitutional process.
    So Hamilton, a bootlicker and absolute monarchist is a more realiable source then the person who wrote the Declaration of Independence, the person who wrote the Constitution and was there for the entire time, and the Anti-Federalists that were prophetic in the abuses that would occur? Don't make me laugh. Hamilton was in the Philadelphia Convention for two days before he was removed for being stupid.


    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    And I already pointed out how the decision was reached, and whether you like it or not, it decreed that secession was illegal. Even Madison, in a letter to Daniel Webster during the nullification crisis, indicated that secession was "a violation, without cause, of a faith solemnly pledged." So, sorry. If you are going to base your entire position on the "secession is legal" argument, your position is lost, since it was not.
    I believe that the federal government violating Article I Section IX Clause VI is 'a violation, with cause, of a faith solemnly pledged'. I'm speaking of the Morill Tariff which would have brought back the tariff of abominations. As I said show me where in the Constitution of the United States that the states are prohibited from leaving. It must be a provision that prohibits such action by the states from enacting it. You can't find it because it doesn't exist and Mr. Madison surely would not have accepted the Constitution of the United States if it did. I say this because Mr. Madison wrote the Virginia Ratification that states, "Do, in the name and in behalf of the people of Virginia, declare and make known, that the powers granted under the constitution, being derived from the people of the United States, may be resumed by them whensoever the same shall be perverted to their injury or oppression, and that every power not granted thereby, remains with them and at their will;" Your argument and position is the false one since the author of the Constitution has consistently said the opposite of what you claim.
    Last edited by The_Patriot; 06-11-10 at 04:37 AM.

  8. #348
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    Re: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Post #339 has already been debunked.
    Saying it's debunked and actually using the Constitution are two completely different things.


    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    I'll give you a hint, Texas v, White still stands, so I guess SCOTUS found that Article ! Section X did not apply.
    Actually, it does apply whether or not SCOTUS uses it.


    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Since South Carolina was part of the US, as seceding was illegal, there was no invasion.
    It wasn't a part of the United States and you haven't proven under the Constitution that secession is prohibited to the states. It was an invasion and an act of war.


    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Since the Hartford Convention did not actually result in any state attempting to secede, your point here is irrelevant.
    It doesn't make a difference, since the doctrine was started by the north and the south did it. Your point is irrelevant.

  9. #349
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    Re: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Patriot View Post
    Saying it's debunked and actually using the Constitution are two completely different things.
    Saying it's not debunked an proving your position are two different things. You have not done the latter.

    Actually, it does apply whether or not SCOTUS uses it.
    Not in this case.

    It wasn't a part of the United States and you haven't proven under the Constitution that secession is prohibited to the states. It was an invasion and an act of war.
    It was part of the US, and I have proven that secession was illegal. Therefore it was no invasion.


    It doesn't make a difference, since the doctrine was started by the north and the south did it. Your point is irrelevant.
    Makes a total difference, because in one case, no action was taken, therefore nothing legal needed to be examined. In the other action was taken, therefore the legality was examined. Your point, as I said, does not apply to this scenario.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  10. #350
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    Re: Does the term redneck refer to a culture or race?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Saying it's not debunked an proving your position are two different things. You have not done the latter.
    Funny, but I'm the only one using the Constitution of the United States, which is law and you are using rhetoric. Facts>Opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Not in this case.
    Yes, it does since stare decisis says that it can be overturned for failing to adhere to tradition ie the Declaration of Independence, which is part of federal law.

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    It was part of the US, and I have proven that secession was illegal. Therefore it was no invasion.
    Yes because we all know that your rhetoric trumps actual law and facts.

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Makes a total difference, because in one case, no action was taken, therefore nothing legal needed to be examined. In the other action was taken, therefore the legality was examined. Your point, as I said, does not apply to this scenario.
    Your point does not apply nor does your rhetoric. Bring facts to the table not your rhetoric and screams of I'm right without proof!

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