View Poll Results: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

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Thread: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

  1. #121
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    Re: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Excluding guys that are on SWAT or similar, this is true: most cops are not all that great with guns. Any serious competition shooter will be faster and more accurate than 95% of ordinary LEOs.
    The most respected police and civilian firearms instructor in Ohio noted that if you went to "Targetworld" (A public shooting range in northern Cincinnati) and pulled ten people off the range at random on a saturday afternoon in the winter (the busiest season) and then went over to the nearby Cincinnati Police Department range and pulled ten cops at random and had each group shoot the POlice qualification course and then take a written test on firearms related topics including laws, safety rules etc the 10 target world customers would destroy the cops 99 times out of 100.



  2. #122
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    Re: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    The most respected police and civilian firearms instructor in Ohio noted that if you went to "Targetworld" (A public shooting range in northern Cincinnati) and pulled ten people off the range at random on a saturday afternoon in the winter (the busiest season) and then went over to the nearby Cincinnati Police Department range and pulled ten cops at random and had each group shoot the POlice qualification course and then take a written test on firearms related topics including laws, safety rules etc the 10 target world customers would destroy the cops 99 times out of 100.
    Thats because those individuals take firearms up as a hobby, while its just a small (but important) part of the job of policing.

    Some cops take up firearms as a hobby too, I think your firearms instructor fails to realize this.

    Although to be honest, I don't have much of a hobby in the way of firearms. Hell, If I can't do it at home, and I can't take my kids to do it with me, I can't have it as a hobby currently. I used to go shooting back when I was at Ft. Bragg and didn't have kids.

    When they get older, maybe, but I can't see bringing a 3 and 2 year old into a shooting range.
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  3. #123
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    Re: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Thats because those individuals take firearms up as a hobby, while its just a small (but important) part of the job of policing.

    Some cops take up firearms as a hobby too, I think your firearms instructor fails to realize this.

    Although to be honest, I don't have much of a hobby in the way of firearms. Hell, If I can't do it at home, and I can't take my kids to do it with me, I can't have it as a hobby currently. I used to go shooting back when I was at Ft. Bragg and didn't have kids.

    When they get older, maybe, but I can't see bringing a 3 and 2 year old into a shooting range.
    Given the guy was an MP in the Nam and then spent 10 years as a patrol officer and SWAT member and then a couple decades of the combined county wide SWAT team's head (our county has lots of villages and small cities that cannot afford each to have a SWAT TEAM so each community would provide one officer who would serve in a joint SWAT TEAM) I suspect he knows that. I also (given I spent years defending police officers and various agency LEOs in lawsuits) know that police work involves far more than shooting.

    I also know that when I hear chiefs of police pontificating on firearms laws I just laugh.



  4. #124
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    Re: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Given the guy was an MP in the Nam and then spent 10 years as a patrol officer and SWAT member and then a couple decades of the combined county wide SWAT team's head (our county has lots of villages and small cities that cannot afford each to have a SWAT TEAM so each community would provide one officer who would serve in a joint SWAT TEAM) I suspect he knows that. I also (given I spent years defending police officers and various agency LEOs in lawsuits) know that police work involves far more than shooting.
    Understood. Although strangely, I would suspect that many rural departments (especially rural southern departments) have a greater portion of their police force interested in firearms as a hobby than your city departments. In the country people in general like to go shoot targets in their own back yards, its a hobby they can enjoy. There are too many ****ty laws to make hobbies such as gun shooting very enjoyable in cities. Your police force is usually a representative of your city as a whole, so there you go.

    I also know that when I hear chiefs of police pontificating on firearms laws I just laugh.
    Why is that?
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

  5. #125
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    Re: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Understood. Although strangely, I would suspect that many rural departments (especially rural southern departments) have a greater portion of their police force interested in firearms as a hobby than your city departments. In the country people in general like to go shoot targets in their own back yards, its a hobby they can enjoy. There are too many ****ty laws to make hobbies such as gun shooting very enjoyable in cities. Your police force is usually a representative of your city as a whole, so there you go.

    Why is that?
    Good points-

    POlice chiefs tend to be the pet monkeys of the politicians they answer too

    I had the Cincy Chief of POlice make the mistake of arguing guns with me. I tore him up so badly on a local TV station that the mayor of the city chewed his ass out the next day. He claimed they needed an assault weapon ban (remember cities can only pass misdemeanor ordinances) because they caught a "drug dealer" with a loaded tech 9 (32 round magazine-makes it a machine gun under Ohio law) and they couldn't arrest him.

    So I pointed out all the laws they could have used to arrest the mope.

    You know as well as I do that most big city police chiefs are politicians and bureaucrats more than they are cops

    and nothing psses me off more than one of those clowns trying to use his status to con the press into thinking they know more about guns than people like me or worse, claiming only cops ought to be allowed to have 17 shot glocks etc



  6. #126
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    Re: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Given the guy was an MP in the Nam and then spent 10 years as a patrol officer and SWAT member and then a couple decades of the combined county wide SWAT team's head (our county has lots of villages and small cities that cannot afford each to have a SWAT TEAM so each community would provide one officer who would serve in a joint SWAT TEAM) I suspect he knows that. I also (given I spent years defending police officers and various agency LEOs in lawsuits) know that police work involves far more than shooting.
    .

    Are you talking about B. L. ? Last name starts with an F?

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  7. #127
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    Re: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Good points-

    POlice chiefs tend to be the pet monkeys of the politicians they answer too

    I had the Cincy Chief of POlice make the mistake of arguing guns with me. I tore him up so badly on a local TV station that the mayor of the city chewed his ass out the next day. He claimed they needed an assault weapon ban (remember cities can only pass misdemeanor ordinances) because they caught a "drug dealer" with a loaded tech 9 (32 round magazine-makes it a machine gun under Ohio law) and they couldn't arrest him.

    So I pointed out all the laws they could have used to arrest the mope.

    You know as well as I do that most big city police chiefs are politicians and bureaucrats more than they are cops

    and nothing psses me off more than one of those clowns trying to use his status to con the press into thinking they know more about guns than people like me or worse, claiming only cops ought to be allowed to have 17 shot glocks etc
    Ahh, I understand where you are coming from now. In the previous one liner I couldn't quite figure it out.
    But now with the explanation, I totally agree.

    And yes, I completely agree that far too often Police Chiefs are wayy more politician than they are police officer.
    For that matter, anyone usually above the rank of Sergeant in a police department is. The rest of them rarely go out to a scene and do anything other than be present for cameras or to act like they are in charge of an investigation.
    Once you pass a certain rank within a police organization, you become more "administrator" than "policeman".
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

  8. #128
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Are you talking about B. L. ? Last name starts with an F?
    No, its the guy who runs the most prestigious firearms training academy in Ohio



  9. #129
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    Re: Should police be required to shoot to wound suspects who threatening their lives?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    No, its the guy who runs the most prestigious firearms training academy in Ohio
    K thx NM.


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