View Poll Results: Should the law be changed so that gays can serve openly in the military.

Voters
217. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, do it now

    79 36.41%
  • Yes, but after the Pentagon completes it study on the issue

    11 5.07%
  • No, do not change the law

    14 6.45%
  • No, DADT should be repealed and gays not allowed to serve at all

    104 47.93%
  • Other, please explain

    9 4.15%
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Thread: Gays in the Military

  1. #151
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    Re: Gays in the Military

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    Why?

    The time for equality in any aspect of this country is always now. If we ever are going to see the day where the phrase that "All men are created equal" is actually accurate in describing this country we must fight for equality, for everyone, in every situation.
    Your star,

    Perhaps you should join the military and endeavor to change it from the inside. Spend some time among the ranks and see if you can effectuate your agenda.

  2. #152
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    Re: Gays in the Military

    Quote Originally Posted by alms View Post
    Your star,

    Perhaps you should join the military and endeavor to change it from the inside. Spend some time among the ranks and see if you can effectuate your agenda.
    Why would (s)he do that when the change will come from congress and not the military?
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  3. #153
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    Re: Gays in the Military

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    1) I disagree that we should refrain from idealism in the military. It should in fact be one of the many goals for the military.
    Redress,

    Don't you think the primary goal of our military should be operational efficiency and tactical proficiency?

    2) The issue is whether it will work. I think we all agree that if it will not, then it should not be implemented. Part of the explanation of why it will is that forcing people to be responsible for their own emotional reactions is not harmful to the military, and will actually lead to better soldiers.
    I don't think we "all" agree. It seems most people don't care about whether or not it will work. Mostly they're concerned with justice and equality. Idealism seems to be their main concern.

  4. #154
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    Re: Gays in the Military

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Why would (s)he do that when the change will come from congress and not the military?
    Redress,

    My position is that the military should decide for itself. I think if someone wants to tell the military what it should do then they should spend some time in the uniform first. That's why I don't have a strong opinion one way or the other.

  5. #155
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    Re: Gays in the Military

    Quote Originally Posted by alms View Post
    Redress,

    Don't you think the primary goal of our military should be operational efficiency and tactical proficiency?
    Certainly. That is not, nor has it ever been the only goal of the military however.

    I don't think we "all" agree. It seems most people don't care about whether or not it will work. Mostly they're concerned with justice and equality. Idealism seems to be their main concern.
    You are misunderstanding the discussion. Yes, one reason gays should be allowed to serve openly is because it is the right thing to do. With that in mind, the next question is will it work, and yes, it will work.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  6. #156
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    Re: Gays in the Military

    Quote Originally Posted by alms View Post
    Redress,

    My position is that the military should decide for itself. I think if someone wants to tell the military what it should do then they should spend some time in the uniform first. That's why I don't have a strong opinion one way or the other.
    The military does not make policy for itself, nor should it. Congress makes the laws, the president is the CinC.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  7. #157
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    Re: Gays in the Military

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Certainly. That is not, nor has it ever been the only goal of the military however.
    Redress,

    I didn't say that it was.

    You are misunderstanding the discussion. Yes, one reason gays should be allowed to serve openly is because it is the right thing to do. With that in mind, the next question is will it work, and yes, it will work.
    I think the "next" question should be the first and only question. I don't believe I'm misunderstanding anything.

  8. #158
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    Re: Gays in the Military

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    The military does not make policy for itself, nor should it. Congress makes the laws, the president is the CinC.
    Redress,

    I disagree. The military is in the best position to decide internal matters. Politicians do not always have operational and tactical efficiency in mind.

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    Re: Gays in the Military

    Quote Originally Posted by alms View Post
    Redress,

    I didn't say that it was.



    I think the "next" question should be the first and only question. I don't believe I'm misunderstanding anything.
    Then your conclusion is flawed. Doing the right thing should always be part of the equation for any decision, including those with the military. We do not intentionally target civilians because it would be wrong. We do not turn a blind eye to our soldiers who commit crimes while on duty(which is thankfully exceedingly rare) because it is wrong. Ethics do play a role in military decisions.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Gays in the Military

    Quote Originally Posted by alms View Post
    Redress,

    I disagree. The military is in the best position to decide internal matters. Politicians do not always have operational and tactical efficiency in mind.
    We do not allow the military to make those decisions for very good reasons. The military is an instrument of the people, not the other way around. It is not independent.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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