View Poll Results: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

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  • Yes, it was bad for America

    48 41.03%
  • No, it was good for America

    51 43.59%
  • A little bad and a little good. Overall it was neutral

    4 3.42%
  • A little bad and a little good. It changed a lot but not one way or the other.

    10 8.55%
  • Other...

    6 5.13%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

  1. #211
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    Re: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

    I am quite sorry you are pissed about my starting this thread, 1069.
    Feh. it doesn't matter. I still like you alright.

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    Re: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    These bad puns are nuts.
    Your puns are so vulvar.

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    Re: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Your puns are so vulvar.
    I love it when you talk dirty.

  4. #214
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    Re: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    The threads degenerated into The Mommy Wars*, while a few misogynistic males sat by nodding approvingly, pleased with the chaos they had wrought.
    There is no better way to oppress a group of people than to divide them, turn them against one another, and cause them to fall into fighting among themselves.
    Meanwhile, the real enemy- patriarchy and male privilege- smirks while slinking off stage left, content that the status quo has and will continue to be maintained.
    There are plenty of women who benefit and prefer the status quo of men being responsible for their well-being, versus having to step up and take care of themselves. They remind me of the the Aunts in Handmaid's Tale.

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    Re: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    There are plenty of women who benefit and prefer the status quo of men being responsible for their well-being, versus having to step up and take care of themselves. They remind me of the the Aunts in Handmaid's Tale.
    Or the kapos at Auschwitz.
    But I think Atwood is actually the one who made that point, in Handmaid.

    Besides "divide and conquer", that is another good way to keep a group oppressed: select a few members of the group, and offer them special privileges and/or protections in exchange for their collaboration in helping you oppress the rest of the group.

  6. #216
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    Re: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    Or the kapos at Auschwitz.
    But I think Atwood is actually the one who made that point, in Handmaid.

    Besides "divide and conquer", that is another good way to keep a group oppressed: select a few members of the group, and offer them special privileges and/or protections in exchange for their collaboration in helping you oppress the rest of the group.
    I almost went there, but for Godwin's Rule. And yeah, that's it, exactly. Which is why some fight so hard to keep the status quo. Otherwise, they might have to pay for half a date.

  7. #217
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    Re: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

    No, not at all.

    As long as I still have a clean house and food on the table when I get home from work.
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

  8. #218
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    Re: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    I am quite sorry you are pissed about my starting this thread, 1069. I was intentionally provocative to start debate and it worked - it has been an excellent discussion which you seriously contributed to. Thank you.



    IMHO, there is an important difference between the emancipation of blacks and the emancipation of women. That is the impact on families.

    Women's liberation is something to be proud of. Extending the vote and enabling the economic prospects have been positive developments in our history.

    However, this has dramatically changed families in America. The typical family of today is very different than the typical family of the 1950s. Women work and so you have 2 earner households. There is also an increase in single parent families (mixed: pos - out of bad marriages, neg - missing role models for children). Other changes have occurred as well, which may or may not be due to women's liberation: increased education (positive - for men and women), increased urbanization (mixed), increased drug use (mixed), increased crime (negative), surely others I am missing. I don't know how much can be laid at the feet of women's liberation but surely some of it is related.

    I am glad we could discuss it.
    I agree that there are some downsides - there's a downside to every single thing.

    But I don't believe for one second that families were more 'solid' before the late 1800's/early 1900's. I think our knowledge is skewed simply because we're not living it - and have few direct ties who can tell the tale.

    I think a lot of men have been unstable alcoholics, abusive bastards, unfit to work and laze-about-leeches and incapable of staying faithful just as much now as were in the past. Just because the family *was* together in a home doesn't mean it *was* a good family. Just because the wife didn't work and was home 24/7 doesn't mean the home was happy and well-kept. Everyone just *thinks* that's how things were.

    What really has changed was the power that women had to do something about it *and* everyone's awareness of such behavior - domestic violence is now unacceptable and women do not have to tolerate such behavior. Unlike 100 years ago when a woman had no recourse and simply had to endure it. Or the children - there was no DHS 100 years ago, the children were also abused and mistreated, starved and abandoned - and no one was there to help them, either.

    If life before Women's Lib was so 'pleasant' then such strong and troublesome efforts wouldn't have been made to change it.

    *edit* Ok - so I left out the opposite side of the story as I see it. I don't think an unhappy woman in an unpleasant marriage would be a good mother, either. I went through years and years of endless bitterness over our financial situation and the fact that the affordable solution was for me to be a sahm - I hated it and took my anger and unhappiness out on everyone and intentionally neglected my children, the home and all my 'duties'
    I do those things now - I've let go - but when I was bitter about it this home was FAR from happy.

    I imagine that's how things were back then, too.
    Last edited by Aunt Spiker; 05-13-10 at 10:44 PM.
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    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

  9. #219
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    Re: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

    My grandfather left home at 14 because he was being beaten within an inch of his life. He was responsible and on his own at a time when kids today can't even drive.

  10. #220
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    Re: Overall, was feminism bad for America?

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    I am sure there is a variety of opinions on this. Such a social movement changed a lot about America, some good and some bad. What is your opinion about it overall?
    Could you perhaps include some material in your OP...maybe illustrating classical feminism with modern feminism?

    ...or at least a coloring section and some pop-up pictures....

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