View Poll Results: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

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Thread: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by O_Guru View Post
    yes its funny spammers keep voting

    on a general side note
    the debate basically stopped because no one has come up with any good reasons to stop it and support discrimination yet
    Maybe people are not willing to acknowledge other arguments? I oppose gay marriage not simply because of my religious belief's but because homosexuality is not equal with conventional marriage between a man and a woman. They aren't the same union and thus homosexuals can never marry each other. Because of my Christian belief's I could never support something or vote in favor of something that I know is wrong (homosexuality).
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Maybe people are not willing to acknowledge other arguments? I oppose gay marriage not simply because of my religious belief's but because homosexuality is not equal with conventional marriage between a man and a woman. They aren't the same union and thus homosexuals can never marry each other. Because of my Christian belief's I could never support something or vote in favor of something that I know is wrong (homosexuality).
    Like the OP i dont think its a mater of "aknowledgment" its a matter of it being justly applicable to OTHERS, the LAW and choosing to not DISCRIMINATE. Believe what YOU want but in this case once you choose to stop others I find it very hypocritical and pompus. I respect you right to think how you want and your religious beliefs but you have no buisness in other peoples affairs. What if other religions are fine with it? So your gonns force yours on them?

    I myself am not gay and can honestly say im not exactly a "fan" of it but as an American I clearly understand its none of my buisness, it has ZERO effect on me in real life and i would never force my views on them. I cant even imagine how anybody is pompus enough to think it is there buisness. They should clearly be allowed to marry because its discrimination and i havent read anything in this thread that would be classified as such. At best if it bothered me too bad, it doesnt, but if it did i just wouldnt vote at all on the subject. I may not vote yes to "support" it but i could never bring myself to vote no to "discriminate" against m fellow americans
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by O_Guru View Post
    Like the OP i dont think its a mater of "aknowledgment" its a matter of it being justly applicable to OTHERS, the LAW and choosing to not DISCRIMINATE. Believe what YOU want but in this case once you choose to stop others I find it very hypocritical and pompus. I respect you right to think how you want and your religious beliefs but you have no buisness in other peoples affairs. What if other religions are fine with it? So your gonns force yours on them?
    But applying it to them forces everyone to acknowledge gay marriage and by law treat their union as equal to real marriage. It's not discrimination, as far as things go homosexuals have every right as anyone else does, they can marry as well... a member of the opposite sex. Homosexuals are regular people, they aren't a race or religion, they are just people with a different sexual preference. I discriminate against the act of homosexuality and see it as sinful and wrong, not against the homosexuals themselves. No one is stopping them from having sex, however we are not going to extend marital benefits to something that is not marriage. I find it hypocritical for the homosexual community to impose upon religious individuals their secular morality and belief that homosexuality is not wrong or immoral. It can be spun both ways. You are right in that I have no business in other's affairs, but I do have the right to vote according to my belief's and believe that what others do is wrong and should be stopped (just like in the case of abortion).
    I myself am not gay and can honestly say im not exactly a "fan" of it but as an American I clearly understand its none of my buisness, it has ZERO effect on me in real life and i would never force my views on them. I cant even imagine how anybody is pompus enough to think it is there buisness. They should clearly be allowed to marry because its discrimination and i havent read anything in this thread that would be classified as such. At best if it bothered me too bad, it doesnt, but if it did i just wouldnt vote at all on the subject. I may not vote yes to "support" it but i could never bring myself to vote no to "discriminate" against m fellow americans
    What gays do is none of my business as well. However it does affect me and my society if we extend full legal rights to homosexual unions and call it marriage. I do think homosexual's and their significant others should be allowed to visit each other in the hospital (I also think the wife/husband shouldn't be the only one allowed to visit at times either). It is not discrimination against homosexuals to not allow them to marry each other. The only discrimination is against the act of homosexuality and not accepting it as equal and moral with true marriage. Homosexuals have all the rights and services that anyone else does, the one thing they don't have is the public condoning the act of homosexuality and recognizing it as moral and equal with a heterosexual marriage.
    When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. -Socrates
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    But applying it to them forces everyone to acknowledge gay marriage and by law treat their union as equal to real marriage. It's not discrimination, as far as things go homosexuals have every right as anyone else does, they can marry as well... a member of the opposite sex. Homosexuals are regular people, they aren't a race or religion, they are just people with a different sexual preference. I discriminate against the act of homosexuality and see it as sinful and wrong, not against the homosexuals themselves. No one is stopping them from having sex, however we are not going to extend marital benefits to something that is not marriage. I find it hypocritical for the homosexual community to impose upon religious individuals their secular morality and belief that homosexuality is not wrong or immoral. It can be spun both ways. You are right in that I have no business in other's affairs, but I do have the right to vote according to my belief's and believe that what others do is wrong and should be stopped (just like in the case of abortion).
    nope its NOT discrimination against you at all, unless you are in denial and trying to be illogical and bias. nice try but religion doesnt own the word marriage and that FACT is undeniable. Sorry you argument hold not water based on this fact, marriage has NOTHING to do with religion unless the parties involve CHOOSE it too.Religion still wouldnt have to "extend marital benefits" to anyone they doent see fit JUST LIKE RIGHT NOW, that wouldnt change.

    So NO it isnt NOT spinning both ways in REALITY that just an argument you are trying to use that actually has no barring. Unless of course you already believe that you are discriminated everyday in every single way that doesnt follow your religious belifes

    people that get married by a magistrate
    women having equal rights
    minorities having equal rights
    premarital sex
    masturbation
    cussing
    drinking alcohol
    etc etc

    not saying YOUR religion believes my list above because i dont know but thats just a small list of things religions do not agree with that are allowed by law so NO its not hypocritical for gays to want marriage nor does it discriminate against you and yes it is discrimination against them not to allow it.

    Also i dont disagree that its you RIGHT to vote what you believe, that was never said that you simply dont have the right to vote. You do, that is right, I agree 100%. Its a matter of in aMERICA DO YOU THINK ITS RIGHT TO STOP IT. i was just pointing out how hypocritical i find it has an american and how pompous i think it makes you in this case to stop others and be in their business. You do have the right to vote how you seem fit but stopping them will still be arrogant and discriminative.

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    What gays do is none of my business as well. However it does affect me and my society if we extend full legal rights to homosexual unions and call it marriage. I do think homosexual's and their significant others should be allowed to visit each other in the hospital (I also think the wife/husband shouldn't be the only one allowed to visit at times either). It is not discrimination against homosexuals to not allow them to marry each other. The only discrimination is against the act of homosexuality and not accepting it as equal and moral with true marriage. Homosexuals have all the rights and services that anyone else does, the one thing they don't have is the public condoning the act of homosexuality and recognizing it as moral and equal with a heterosexual marriage.
    It actually doesnt effect you in reality, it effects your moral compass and maybe in some other shallow ways but not you in general. Two ugly people kissing may effect me to in a very shallow way but not in reality, should i stop them? when we are talking about freedoms and discrimination and fellow americans the effect has to be a real one and apply to your fundamental lifestyle, yours wouldnt be effected.


    and they do NOT have the same rights and it is in FACT discrimination, you are playing semantics and I wont let you its such a cop out argument to say they can marry anyone they want just not same sex lol thats just dumb.

    They are denied equal fair marriage and its a shame, it nobodys business who two consenting adults marry. ANd like i said Im not exactly a gay fan Im an nondiscrimination fan and stick up for my fellow americans.
    Last edited by O_Guru; 05-29-10 at 04:05 PM.
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Here we go again.

    Don't argue with a bigot; their prejudices almost make perfect sense to them.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by O_Guru View Post
    nope its NOT discrimination against you at all, unless you are in denial and trying to be illogical and bias. nice try but religion doesnt own the word marriage and that FACT is undenialable. Sorry you argument hold not water based on this fact, marriage has NOTHING to do with religion unless the parties involve CHOOSE it too.Religion still wouldnt have to "extend marital benefits" to anyone they doent see fit JUST LIKE RIGHT NOW, that wouldnt change.
    Yes it is discrimination, it's the state saying secular morals are superior to that of religious Christians. Personally if a state voted by popular majority to accept gay marriage then I would be fine with it. I wouldn't support it personally and I would vote against it, but I would obey the law. Who is necessarily imposing on others? In California they voted on gay marriage (proposition 8) and gay marriage was turned down by a popular vote. Now they are trying to find some way to impose gay marriage upon everyone even though it was voted down.

    On marriage, I personally believe that marriages don't deserve the special status that they do. The government should merely acknowledge and man and a woman being married for legal reasons.
    So NO it isnt NOT spinning both ways in REALITY that just an argument you are trying to use that actually has no barring. Unless of course you already believe that you are discminated everyday in every single way that doesnt follow your religious belifes
    Yes it does spin both ways. In reality it would be just as I said it would be. It would be the state forcing everyone to acknowledge two men or two women as a legally married couple. Like I said, in California they are discriminating against the popular majority that voted to prevent gay marriage. They want to ram it through regardless of what the voters said. They are disrespecting their votes and discrimination against their beliefs.
    people that get married by a majistraite
    woemen having equal rights
    miniorites havung equl rights
    permarital sex
    masturbation
    cussing
    drinking alcohol
    etc etc
    My religious belief's would only hold that premarital sex, masturbation, and becoming too drunk with alcohol as being wrong. However, these things are different when compared to homosexual marriage. I don't support any of these things and neither does the state. The state hasn't made these things illegal (just like how homosexuality isn't a crime either). It would be discrimination if the state were to pass laws saying every couple that has premarital sex deserves special rights or that everyone who masturbates deserves free pornography. The government doesn't impose morality on those areas that you mentioned, they aren't respecting those acts and giving them special protection/extending rights to them.
    not saying YOUR religion belives my list above because i dont know but thats just a small list of thinkgs religions do not agree with that are allowed by law so NO its not hypocritical for gays to want marriage nor does it discrimate against you and yes it is discrimination againt them not to allow it.
    Again, the things you posted above are not given a moral seal of approval by the government. They are not extended special rights and the government is not telling everyone to accept those behaviors as equal to moral ones. They aren't telling people that premarital sex is morally equal to sex within marriage.
    Allso i dont dissagree that its you RIGHT to vote what you believe, that was never said that you simply dont have the right to vote. You do, that is right, I agree 100%. Its a matter of in aMERICA DO YOU THINK ITS RIGHT TO STOP IT. i was just pointing out how hypicritical i find it has an american and how pompus i think it makes you in this case to stop others and be in their business. You do have the right to vote how you seem fit but stopping them will still be arrogant and discimintive.
    I agree with you on your first sentence. I also believe that those who support homosexuality have the right to vote for it based on their belief's and convictions. They have theirs and I have mine and I respect their views even though I don't agree with them. However, I don't think I'm pompous for not supporting homosexual marriage. I am not anti-homosexuals, I just doesn't support homosexuality as moral and equal to marriage. I would be against any law that criminalize homosexuals or repeals any rights from them as people just like anyone else. What I think is pompous is in the case of California where they want to go against the popular vote and impose homosexual marriage on a state that voted to keep marriage between a man and woman. I don't think it's pompous to support homosexual marriage either (I am not saying having that stance makes on pompous nor am I calling you pompous).
    It actually doesnt effect you in reality, it effects your moral compass and maybe in some other shallow ways but not you in general. Two ugly people kissing may effect me to in a very shallow way but not in reality, shouls i stop them? when we are talking about freedoms and discrimination and fellow americans the effect has to be a real one and apply to your fundemantal lifestyle, yours wouldnt be effected.
    It does effect me though. It means that the state and society that I live in views a practice I hold as immoral as being moral and equal to a heterosexual marriage. I plan on going into the medical field, and I would be required to extend spousal benefits to a homosexual couple even though in my eyes they are living in a sinful union. I would have to uphold their "marriage" and legally be required to treat them as any normal married couple. It would effect me personally, and it would effect the society I live in.

    and they do NOT have the same rights and it is in FACT discrimination, you are playing semantics and I wont let you its such a cop out argument to say they can marry anyone they want just not same sex lol thats just dumb.
    They do have the same rights. In fact, they aren't a "they" group. Homosexuals are normal people with a different sexual preference. Is it discrimination to make bestiality illegal? That is a sexual preference as well. Do we discriminate against them by not allowing a man to legally marry his horse? Homosexuality, heterosexuality, and bestiality are not racial or religious groups. They are all sexual preferences and acts of sexuality. "Discriminating" against homosexuality is discriminating against the act of homosexual sex in the same way that discriminating against murderers is discriminating against the act of murder.
    They are denied equal fair marriage and its a shame, it nobodys buisness who two consenting adults marry. ANd like i said Im not exactly a gay fan Im an nondiscrimanation fan and stick up for my fellow americans.
    They are denied nothing, they have the right to marry someone of the opposite sex that I do. They have the right to live and travel and receive all rights that I do as a heterosexual male. The only difference between me and a homosexual is the fact that they are sexually attracted to the same gender while I am not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
    Here we go again.

    Don't argue with a bigot; their prejudices almost make perfect sense to them.
    I'm not a bigot. I have gay friends and ex gay friends and I treat them with no disrespect or any differently then my other friends. You judge my character based off of my beliefs. You are not only wrong, but you are asserting your own bigotry by assuming that I myself am bigoted against homosexuals simply because I view homosexuality as a sin.
    Last edited by digsbe; 05-29-10 at 04:30 PM.
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by O_Guru View Post
    on a general side note
    the debate basically stopped because no one has come up with any good reasons to stop it and support discrimination yet
    No.

    It's not that no one has come up with any good reasons, it is that those debating realized that they would not convince each other, and thus saw no point in continuing.

    Many good reasons were given...but no good reason that all could agree with.

    Of course, such a strange entity does not and never will exist.
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Yes it is discrimination, it's the state saying secular morals are superior to that of religious Christians. Personally if a state voted by popular majority to accept gay marriage then I would be fine with it. I wouldn't support it personally and I would vote against it, but I would obey the law. Who is necessarily imposing on others? In California they voted on gay marriage (proposition 8) and gay marriage was turned down by a popular vote. Now they are trying to find some way to impose gay marriage upon everyone even though it was voted down.
    100% WRONG its not discrimination against you because YOU still get to practice, teach, preach and believe what you want LMAO please dro[ the semantics game because theres no logic to support them LOL

    what it is actually saying is that AMERICAN laws, rights and constitution is a HIGHER value than your religon whivh is and has always been true.



    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Yes it does spin both ways. In reality it would be just as I said it would be. It would be the state forcing everyone to acknowledge to men or two women as a legally married couple. Like I said, in California they are discriminating against the popular majority that voted to prevent gay marriage. They want to ram it through regardless of what the voters said. They are disrespecting their votes and discrimination against their beliefs.
    100% wrong again you cant spin it that way, I dont care about california and your attempt at a strawman. Your beliefs would still be in tact nice try and that wouldnt change unless you are under belief everything outside you religion already discrimination LMAO you cant have it both ways and i wont let you because there no logic behind it

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    My religious belief's would only hold that premarital sex, masturbation, and becoming too drunk with alcohol as being wrong. However, these things are different when compared to homosexual marriage. I don't support any of these things and neither does the state. The state hasn't made these things illegal (just like how homosexuality isn't a crime either). It would be discrimination if the state were to pass laws saying every couple that has premarital sex deserves special rights or that everyone who masturbates deserves free pornography. The government doesn't impose morality on those areas that you mentioned, they aren't respecting those acts and giving them special protection/extending rights to them.
    this is where you just exposed admitting gay marriage is "different" from other sins LMAO sorry more word games by you with no logic behind them allowing gay marriage would be extending EQUAL rights not special rights LMAO

    so let me get this straight by "allowing" gay marriages is discrimantion against you BUT allowing certain drug use, prematial sex, masturbation, cussing, porn, etc etc or anything else one may view as a sin is OK and not discrimination? ok got that makes perfect sense LOL

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Again, the things you posted above are not given a moral seal of approval by the government. They are not extended special rights and the government is not telling everyone to accept those behaviors as equal to moral ones. They aren't telling people that premarital sex is morally equal to sex within marriage.
    I cant even believe that you believe what you are typing, gay marriage is not a "special" right LMAO and YES the government does "APPROVE" it because its not illegal, morals dont come into play no matter how much YOU want them too. Nobody said the government approves them morally, allowing gay marriage wouldnt do that either LOL Nice spin but no reality disagrees LOL

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    I agree with you on your first sentence. I also believe that those who support homosexuality have the right to vote for it based on their belief's and convictions. They have theirs and I have mine and I respect their views even though I don't agree with them. However, I don't think I'm pompous for not supporting homosexual marriage. I am not anti-homosexuals, I just doesn't support homosexuality as moral and equal to marriage. I would be against any law that criminalize homosexuals or repeals any rights from them as people just like anyone else. What I think is pompous is in the case of California where they want to go against the popular vote and impose homosexual marriage on a state that voted to keep marriage between a man and woman. I don't think it's pompous to support homosexual marriage either (I am not saying having that stance makes on pompous nor am I calling you pompous).
    do you read what you write, i NEVER said your pompous for not "supporting it" I said you are pompous for thinking its your business and if you would vote no that makes you pompous for stopping it, AGain with california, dont care strawman.

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    It does effect me though. It means that the state and society that I live in views a practice I hold as immoral as being moral and equal to a heterosexual marriage. I plan on going into the medical field, and I would be required to extend spousal benefits to a homosexual couple even though in my eyes they are living in a sinful union. I would have to uphold their "marriage" and legally be required to treat them as any normal married couple. It would effect me personally, and it would effect the society I live in.
    wow, do you live in america? or in reality LMAO
    the medical field? hahahahahah
    the medical field has NO room for your religion nor does it care about it. YOU wouldnt be "required" to do anything but your JOB the insurance company would have to treat them as marriage and any thing a married couple gets you would have to give them.

    Lol basically what if i was a fireman but my religion told me black people and women arent equal to white men BUT the fire department has rules to save the first victim you come to and treat everyone EQUAL if they are not terminal, should i cry its discrimination because I dont want to save blacks or women they arent equal to whites or men in my MORALS???

    how about less dramatic some religions feel gays are going to burn in hell? should that docotor not do anything for a sick gay person? they are going to burn in hell?
    better yet what if its gods will for me to die and you save me or try to save me did you sin?
    see how sily this sounds? your example is just as silly

    like i said in REALITY you are not effected except for shallow arrogant reasons that do not apply to equality, freedoms and not discriminating to your fellow americans


    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    They do have the same rights. In fact, they aren't a "they" group. Homosexuals are normal people with a different sexual preference. Is it discrimination to make bestiality illegal? That is a sexual preference as well. Do we discriminate against them by not allowing a man to legally marry his horse? Homosexuality, heterosexuality, and bestiality are not racial or religious groups. They are all sexual preferences and acts of sexuality. "Discriminating" against homosexuality is discriminating against the act of homosexual sex in the same way that discriminating against murderers is discriminating against the act of murder.
    LMAO did you just cmpare beastliity to gay marriage? Gays are a "they group"
    and gay marriage and gay sex is something between two consenting human adults where there is no victium. LOL

    wow now you are really reaching and being exposed

    They are denied nothing, they have the right to marry someone of the opposite sex that I do. They have the right to live and travel and receive all rights that I do as a heterosexual male. The only difference between me and a homosexual is the fact that they are sexually attracted to the same gender while I am not.

    you realize by YOUR OWN argument I could use it against you and say that religion shouldnt be a group, its just a religion right? but im sure it wont apply then LOl

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    I'm not a bigot. I have gay friends and ex gay friends and I treat them with no disrespect or any differently then my other friends. You judge my character based off of my beliefs. You are not only wrong, but you are asserting your own bigotry by assuming that I myself am bigoted against homosexuals simply because I view homosexuality as a sin.

    even though im not the one that called you a bigot ill answer anyway
    I cant say if you are a bigot or not but there is evidence to support it but that dos NOT make it fact only opinion
    I actually dont believe you have gay "friends" you may know some but i doubt they are real friends BUT i also admit thats not fair so ill just take your word for it

    what happens if they get married and invite you to the wedding do you not go and do you not see them has married?

    Like it was said in this thread many times still no good reason to stop it that doesnt fit one of the descriptions of the OP
    Last edited by O_Guru; 05-29-10 at 04:57 PM.
    PURE STUPIDITY 1.) Glenn Beck doesnt lie. 2.) Obama is Jesus like 3.) Sara Palin is so smart & shes a great speaker. 4.) Obama does just about everything perfect. 5.) Fox doesn' t lean right 6.) Pro-Choice is no different than Pro-Slavery 7.) MSNBC doesn't lean left. 8.) What TSA does is no different than sexual assault & child porn.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    No.

    It's not that no one has come up with any good reasons, it is that those debating realized that they would not convince each other, and thus saw no point in continuing.

    Many good reasons were given...but no good reason that all could agree with.

    Of course, such a strange entity does not and never will exist.
    well just have to agree to disagree then because per the OP i didnt see one has they all fit the OPs description. There wasnt on that was sound, reasonable, logical, non-bais, non-selfish, non-arrogant, hypercritical, non anti-american and didnt support discrimination.

    they all fit the mold of not a good reason by the OP, Some of them didnt match all those reasons but all of them certainly failed the test

    maybe that will change but i doubt it, with other things and discrimination being among the list that will be probably impossible.
    Last edited by O_Guru; 05-29-10 at 05:12 PM. Reason: terrible typing and spelling which i do often due to speed lol
    PURE STUPIDITY 1.) Glenn Beck doesnt lie. 2.) Obama is Jesus like 3.) Sara Palin is so smart & shes a great speaker. 4.) Obama does just about everything perfect. 5.) Fox doesn' t lean right 6.) Pro-Choice is no different than Pro-Slavery 7.) MSNBC doesn't lean left. 8.) What TSA does is no different than sexual assault & child porn.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by O_Guru View Post
    We’ll just have to agree to disagree then because per the OP I didn’t see one has they all fit the OPs description. There wasn’t on that was sound, reasonable, logical, non-bias, non-selfish, non-arrogant, hypercritical, non anti-American and didn’t support discrimination.

    They all fit the mold of not a good reason by the OP, Some of them didn’t match all those reasons but all of them certainly failed the test

    Maybe that will change but I doubt it, with other things and discrimination being among the list that will be probably impossible.
    Thank you for proving my point.

    You did understand my point, yes?
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

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