View Poll Results: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

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    186 43.26%
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Thread: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

  1. #61
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    Cool Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    You or anyone, and stop it as in vote no against it or stop it in general if you had the power too?

    Basically do you think its your or anybody's elses right to tell two consenting adults who or who they cant marry?
    Of course I (and everyone else) has the right to vote their conscience. And there's no requirment (obviously) that voters be either informed or enightend.

    As for the right tell others who they can or can't 'marry?'

    Sure.

    But that doesn't mean they will (or have to) listen.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    I can't inform you as to how you are wrong except about myself.

    And I do in fact call myself 'socially conservative.'

    If your really interested in my personal views,.. here some reading for you.

    OK people, here's the deal with gay marriage
    Your argument is an appeal to the majority fallacy? Most people in society don't agree with gay marriage so there should be no gay marriage? You do realize that 40 years ago, most people didn't agree with interracial marriage? Just because a majority of people don't agree with something doesn't make it wrong.

    I wonder if you will still hold that reasoning when a majority of society believes that gay marriage is fine.
    Last edited by CriticalThought; 05-01-10 at 03:09 PM.

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    rolleyes Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Your argument is an appeal to majority fallacy? Most people in society don't agree with gay marriage so there should be no gay marriage? You do realize that 40 years ago, most people didn't agree with interracial marriage? Just because a majority of people don't agree with something doesn't make it wrong.

    I wonder if you will still hold that reasoning when a majority of society believes that gay marriage is fine.
    Please feel free to cite the argument that I posted where I am appealing to popularity.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    The government can call same sex unions "marriage" all it want's. Sorry but you will have to just grin and bear it.

  5. #65
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Please feel free to cite the argument that I posted where I am appealing to popularity.
    You posted an entire thread. I'm assuming your argument was based on the OPs argument. Or did you have some specific post in the thread that you wanted me to see?

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    Arrow Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    You posted an entire thread. I'm assuming your argument was based on the OPs argument. Or did you have some specific post in the thread that you wanted me to see?
    My first post was #102

    And I added it to the link I posted earlier.

    Chuz Life: Jan. 1, 2009 - 1:43 AM EST
    First things first,... so far as I know, scientists have not yet proven nor disproven that homosexuality is genetic. I emphasize yet because I personally believe it (sexuality) is genetic. So, for me personally to hold someone's sexuality against them would be (to me) the same thing as holding a person's condition with downs syndrome or a cleft pallette or red hair against them.

    I didn't chose my sexuality, and I doubt most gay people chose theirs.

    You may find it odd,.. many even refuse to believe me when I say this; but, morality does not enter into my political calculations where homosexuality and my stance on gay marriage is concerned (nor any of my other political views for that matter)... And it's specifically because I believe a gay persons sexuality is just as genetically pre-disposed as is my own (heterosexuality.)

    Ok. So with that in mind... if you can keep that in mind,... here is my stance on "Gay marriage."

    The preamble to our (United States) Constitution charges our government with the responsibility of "providing the common defense and promoting the general welfare."

    True?

    Please note the word "general" as it is used in the preamble... and ask yourself this question; "how can the government be charged with "promoting the general welfare" and not have the right (derrived from the consent of the people) to make determinations as to what is fitting for the government to encourage or sanction and what not to?"

    I believe that while science has yet to find the genetic "switch" that makes one genetically straight, gay or bisexual,... science has determined it to be the biological "norm"- that human beings are generally "heterosexual." Science has shown that "homosexuality" (in mammals) is the "exception which prove the rule." Meaning, the very fact that homosexuals are rare in number to the population as a whole... serves further to "prove" the point that "humans (mammals) are generally heterosexual."

    (Heterosexuality being necessary for the survival of our species. (pro-creation, et al))

    Beyond all that (above),... it is also my opinion that it is the "family unit" which serves as the most basic building blocks which construct and fortify our communities, societies and our nations.

    Are you with me so far?

    Now you may suggest, and I will agree that there are MANY variations to define what is meant by the term "family unit." And I won't argue that point; as that is clearly the case.

    But, remember... our government is charged only with promoting "the general welfare" of this nation and not the welfare of all individually.

    The "general" population being "heterosexual."

    (do you see where this is going yet?)

    AND (and this AND is very important)

    The "one man-one woman" relationship being the most basic, most SUSTAINABLE relationship (where survival of the species and our societies are concerned)...

    How can anyone NOT conclude that the government HAS, not only the authority but also the DUTY to establish and sanction the form of marriage that BEST meets the "general welfare" needs of our nation; even to the point of INDIFFERENCE towards all the other forms of human "relationships?"

    Since when is being treated with "indifference" tantamount to being unjustly discriminated against?

    I believe our government, as it is charged with by our preamble... has not only the right (with just consent of we the people) to decide which (if any) definition of marriage best conforms with the charge of "promoting the general welfare" and to "promote" it; even to the exclusion of all others... but that our government also has the responsibility to do so.

    Anyway, that is my position on "gay marriage" and my best attempt to support it. I've never seen anyone else state the same so I'm very much interested in both of your (Chet and Adamness) comments.

    Thanks.
    Last edited by Chuz Life; 05-01-10 at 03:22 PM.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    You believe in promoting general welfare? Okay.

    There are 8 to 10 million children of gay parents and same sex couples and the latest 25 years of research indicates that gay couples can raise children just as well as different sex couples. Furthermore there are tens of thousands of children in the foster care system who will never be adopted by a different sex couple and who would do better being raised by a married same sex couple than they would being raised by the state or by an individual parent. Two parent homes whether different sex or opposite sex, are the best at raising children, and the state has an interest in promoting them for the purpose of raising children. Even institutions like the American Pediatric Association have conclusively found that those children would benefit from same sex marriage.

    So if you believe in general welfare, then I would assume you believe in the welfare of all those children, and thus you would choose to support same sex marriage.

    Now this is where your true colors are going to shine through. You say one thing about homosexuality and marriage, but when challenged with the facts, we are going to see the real side of you.

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    Cool Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    You believe in promoting general welfare? Okay.

    There are 8 to 10 million children of gay parents and same sex couples and the latest 25 years of research indicates that gay couples can raise children just as well as different sex couples. Furthermore there are tens of thousands of children in the foster care system who will never be adopted by a different sex couple and who would do better being raised by a married same sex couple than they would being raised by the state or by an individual parent. Two parent homes whether different sex or opposite sex, are the best at raising children, and the state has an interest in promoting them for the purpose of raising children. Even institutions like the American Pediatric Association have conclusively found that those children would benefit from same sex marriage.

    So if you believe in general welfare, then I would assume you believe in the welfare of all those children, and thus you would choose to support same sex marriage.

    Now this is where your true colors are going to shine through. You say one thing about homosexuality and marriage, but when challenged with the facts, we are going to see the real side of you.
    Give me some time and I will find the quotes where I have already dealt with these ideas.

    I'm already on record on these things.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Give me some time and I will find the quotes where I have already dealt with these ideas.

    I'm already on record on these things.
    Okay you do that. And while you are at it, here is the evidence I use to support my arguments.

    Gay and Lesbian Adoptive Parents: Resources for Professionals and Parents-Gay and Lesbian Adoptive Parents: Resources for Professionals and Parents

    http://www.teach.virginia.edu/files/...rents_cdps.pdf

    The Effects of Marriage, Civil Union, and Domestic Partnership Laws on the Health and Well-being of Children -- Pawelski et al. 118 (1): 349 -- Pediatrics

    I look forward to seeing yours...assuming you ever come back to this thread again.

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    joke Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    You really don't need the added flaming at the end of your post,.. do you?

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