View Poll Results: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

Voters
430. You may not vote on this poll
  • No

    186 43.26%
  • Yes, explain

    244 56.74%
Page 176 of 192 FirstFirst ... 76126166174175176177178186 ... LastLast
Results 1,751 to 1,760 of 1915

Thread: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

  1. #1751
    Sage
    roguenuke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Last Seen
    05-17-17 @ 05:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,935

    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Asking me when I decided I was heterosexual as a point that there is no choice to being homosexual usually holds no validity with heterosexuals. Heterosexuals consider heterosexual intercourse to be natural while homosexual intercourse is unnatural. Therefore, there is no need to legitimize heterosexuality to refute the validity of homosexuality.

    The argument that environmental factors may cause homosexuality is very valid in my view. However it doesn't in and of itself validate homosexuality, for me personally, since there are a great many mental disorders which are said to be caused by environmental factors. Don't take that to mean I think homosexuality is a mental disorder, I don't necessarily. I'm sure if I were homosexual I would have a different view on that. My personal religious views are not a strong enough factor for me to rely on in opposition to gay marriage so I've tried to find away to convince myself that it is valid through reading studies on the issue. Personally, I do not feel that homosexuality or gay marriage will affect me personally in anyway, however I do believe it will have some pretty serious affects on our society. Maybe good effects, maybe bad. Time will tell. That is more my concern than anything, and is the only reason I oppose it.

    Since homosexuals can live "marriage-like" lifestyles now, and are as protected by hate laws and discrimination laws as are anyone else, I don't see that legalizing marriage would provide any benefit worthy of the potential risks involved with changing the societal definition of marriage.
    First of all, you are lumping together all heterosexuals. I, and most on here who defend legalizing gm for that matter, are heterosexuals. Heterosexuals are not the group identity of those opposing gm. The main thing that connects most (not all) of those who are against gay marriage is religion. However, not all religions, or even Christians for that matter, are opposed to gay marriage. Some Christian denominations do not even consider homosexuality a sin. Also, Christians are made up of individuals, and not all individuals accept all the teachings of the church they attend, so there are also many individual Christians who do not consider homosexuality a sin. Along with that, there are also some religions and religious people who consider homosexuality a sin, but choose not to oppose secular gay marriage, because they do not consider the government's institution of marriage to be the same as private/religious marriage.

    Second, it really isn't that hard to compare the bad effects of gay marriage to the good effects. Gay marriage is legal in 5 states now, and DC. I haven't heard of many of those "bad things" that you're worrying about happening in those states. Also, we have history to help us to determine how people may react to changes that they wouldn't necessarily like, but that really don't affect them, especially where marriage is concerned.

    Also, there are some important legal benefits to being married that don't come from just living together in a married-like lifestyle. One that comes to mind, that many don't consider, is spouses cannot be compelled to testify against their spouse in court. Some others include being able to make medical decisions for the spouse, ensure that each is protected in case of separation, and makes entering into certain legal contracts easier. There are plenty more advantages to being married, but much of them come down to one contract to take the place of several.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  2. #1752
    User
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Last Seen
    06-22-10 @ 03:32 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    111

    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Let people call themselves what they want, just don't force me to call it that.
    Thank God the first response is correct. So I don't have to read 175 pages.

  3. #1753
    Advisor BCR's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Heart of Dixie
    Last Seen
    12-06-13 @ 04:21 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    598

    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Does it pain you that much to use the word Marriage to describe a Gay couples union? That seems somewhat childish.

  4. #1754
    Irrelevant Pissant

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Last Seen
    03-13-14 @ 07:55 PM
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    4,194

    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Also, there are some important legal benefits to being married that don't come from just living together in a married-like lifestyle. One that comes to mind, that many don't consider, is spouses cannot be compelled to testify against their spouse in court.
    What is so special about homosexual sex that it should be used as an excuse not to testify against someone you care about? If my best friend got in trouble, I wouldn't want to testify against him. I think my best friend and I are closer than most married couples. The trait that distinguishes us from a homosexual couple is that we don't have sex with each other. How does that make our relationship any less worthy of being protected from having to testify against each other?

    Some others include being able to make medical decisions for the spouse,
    Why? What if my spouse can't bring herself to pull the plug when I am a vegetable despite my wishes? Or what if I just don't want her to be burdened with that kind of responsibility? I would rather have my best friend making that kind of decision. Why can't I get the same privileges with my best friend?

    I am somehow missing the logical connection that relates any of these privileges to sex.

  5. #1755
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    University of San Diego
    Last Seen
    04-14-11 @ 02:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    672
    Blog Entries
    3

    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    I am very secular, especially politically, and my personal religious/mystical beliefs bear no relation on how I feel about Gay Marriage. Indeed, my connection to my higher spiritual power is very personal, and I have not been in a church for any sort of service in a long (five years? Six?) time.

    Yet, I am consistently and constantly against gay marriage in any shape or form it resides in. Too many, the debate is not framed by morality v. immortality, but instead by the pervading sense that Gay Marriage is a tipping point in our society that validates the long held belief that equality can be enforced at the point of a gun, as well as equality must come before the freedom of speech, the freedom of religion, and the freedom to assemble.

    Now, this may not be completely fair. I have many gay friends who I have no problems with. My barber, who I love dearly in the most platonic sense, is also gay as well as one of my Aunts. I have no problem with homosexuality in the slightest, but I have all the problems in the world with the various factions that have aligned themselves to push upon the public the moniker "Gay Marriage."

  6. #1756
    Sage
    roguenuke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Last Seen
    05-17-17 @ 05:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,935

    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Panache View Post
    What is so special about homosexual sex that it should be used as an excuse not to testify against someone you care about? If my best friend got in trouble, I wouldn't want to testify against him. I think my best friend and I are closer than most married couples. The trait that distinguishes us from a homosexual couple is that we don't have sex with each other. How does that make our relationship any less worthy of being protected from having to testify against each other?



    Why? What if my spouse can't bring herself to pull the plug when I am a vegetable despite my wishes? Or what if I just don't want her to be burdened with that kind of responsibility? I would rather have my best friend making that kind of decision. Why can't I get the same privileges with my best friend?

    I am somehow missing the logical connection that relates any of these privileges to sex.
    No, you are mistakenly relating marriage to sex. Sex is not marriage. A civil marriage to someone is directly giving them the legal rights to make those decisions. And the spousal testimony rights are directly from the US government. You haven't really argued against anything I have said.

    The government gives anyone who is married the right not to testify. At the moment, since only heterosexual marriages are recognized by the federal government, that means that only having heterosexual intimacies with someone actually gives you the right not to testify against your spouse. So the question should be, what makes heterosexual sex so special that it determines who someone should be protected from testifying against or not being having testimony from them used against you?

    Also, if you had same sex marriage, then you could marry your best friend legally if you would prefer to have him make all those decisions and get the benefits from that marriage. You could even enter into a civil marriage with him, and be privately married to a woman you loved if you prefer.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  7. #1757
    Bus Driver to Hell
    Thorgasm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:57 PM
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    68,198

    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Panache View Post
    What is so special about homosexual sex that it should be used as an excuse not to testify against someone you care about? If my best friend got in trouble, I wouldn't want to testify against him. I think my best friend and I are closer than most married couples. The trait that distinguishes us from a homosexual couple is that we don't have sex with each other. How does that make our relationship any less worthy of being protected from having to testify against each other?
    What is so special about heterosexual sex? I fail to see how the ability to procreate would give them the right to not testify against their spouse, their peer as the head of a family unit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Panache View Post
    Why? What if my spouse can't bring herself to pull the plug when I am a vegetable despite my wishes? Or what if I just don't want her to be burdened with that kind of responsibility? I would rather have my best friend making that kind of decision. Why can't I get the same privileges with my best friend?

    I am somehow missing the logical connection that relates any of these privileges to sex.
    You could marry your best friend and not have sex. You could also have a living will or give your best friend Power of Attorney.

    You are focusing on one specific right here. There are tons of rights that married people are afforded.
    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



  8. #1758
    Irrelevant Pissant

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Last Seen
    03-13-14 @ 07:55 PM
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    4,194

    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    No, you are mistakenly relating marriage to sex.
    No. Precisely the opposite. Everyone else on the thread is relating marriage to sex, and I am the only one asking why. If you divorce the concept of marriage from the concept of sex, then the whole homosexual marriage argument falls apart. Straight men who want to marry other straight men are being discriminated against. Are they being discriminated against for being straight? Homosexual men who want to marry homosexual women are not being discriminated against. They are free to do so. Without connecting sex to marriage (and by marriage I mean this exclusive list of privileges of which we are speaking) then sexual orientation has no bearing.

    The government gives anyone who is married the right not to testify. At the moment, since only heterosexual marriages are recognized by the federal government, that means that only having heterosexual intimacies with someone actually gives you the right not to testify against your spouse.
    See? Right there. You accuse me of mistakenly connecting sex and marriage, and then you connect them yourself in the very next paragraph.

    So the question should be, what makes heterosexual sex so special that it determines who someone should be protected from testifying against or not being having testimony from them used against you?
    Dunno. Seems silly to me. Maybe the government shouldn't be involved in giving out goodies based on your sexual relationships. Whaddaya think?

    Also, if you had same sex marriage, then you could marry your best friend legally if you would prefer to have him make all those decisions and get the benefits from that marriage. You could even enter into a civil marriage with him, and be privately married to a woman you loved if you prefer.
    Sex is not marriage. A civil marriage to someone is directly giving them the legal rights to make those decisions. And the spousal testimony rights are directly from the US government. You haven't really argued against anything I have said.

    The government gives anyone who is married the right not to testify. At the moment, since only heterosexual marriages are recognized by the federal government, that means that only having heterosexual intimacies with someone actually gives you the right not to testify against your spouse. So the question should be, what makes heterosexual sex so special that it determines who someone should be protected from testifying against or not being having testimony from them used against you?

    Also, if you had same sex marriage, then you could marry your best friend legally if you would prefer to have him make all those decisions and get the benefits from that marriage. You could even enter into a civil marriage with him, and be privately married to a woman you loved if you prefer.
    And gay couples could be publicly married to someone of the opposite sex, and privately married to someone of the same sex.

    Marriage just isn't a business in which the government should be involved.

  9. #1759
    Irrelevant Pissant

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Last Seen
    03-13-14 @ 07:55 PM
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    4,194

    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    What is so special about heterosexual sex? I fail to see how the ability to procreate would give them the right to not testify against their spouse, their peer as the head of a family unit.
    I know, right? It's kinda ridiculous.



    You could marry your best friend and not have sex.
    No I can't. He's a dude. If my best friend was a chick I suppose I could do that. Then again, gay men can marry gay women and not have sex.

    You could also have a living will or give your best friend Power of Attorney.
    Gay men can also have a living will or give their partner power of attorney.

    You are focusing on one specific right here. There are tons of rights that married people are afforded.
    And what makes my relationship with my best friend unworthy of any of those "rights"? Or for that matter, my relationship with my mom? Or my little brother?

  10. #1760
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    10-26-10 @ 06:34 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,978

    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    No I can't. He's a dude. If my best friend was a chick I suppose I could do that. Then again, gay men can marry gay women and not have sex.
    Didn't WindoverVocalChords have some strange arrangement like that?
    I thought she said she and her partner married two gay men, or something.
    Maybe it was that she married her partner's ex-husband, and her partner married her ex's boyfriend.
    It was something very bizarre like that.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •