View Poll Results: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

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    186 43.26%
  • Yes, explain

    244 56.74%
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Thread: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

  1. #1541
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    First of all, some homosexuals are religious. You are assuming that they are not just because many religions consider homosexuality a sin.

    I think every Unitarian I've ever met has been gay.
    I've known some lesbians who were Presbyterians, too.

  2. #1542
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Panache View Post
    Where do you get the idea that a gay gene would somehow undermine the bible? Does the bible say somewhere that it isn't a genetic trait?
    No, but the Bible does say it's unnatural. The followers of Christianity and believers in the bible are greatly influenced by what is written in it. If it is genetically proven that the bible's assumption that homosexuality is unnatural is proven false, then organized Christian religions have a lot of problems on their hands.

    The main argument against legitimizing or legalizing homosexuality is that it is unnatural and they they should not be entitled to the rights and privileges of those that follow a "natural" or "legitimate" lifestyle. If people are in fact born gay just as they are born Caucasian or male or female, then it is, in fact, discrimination to deny them these rights and privileges.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    A question regarding the recent discussion: How does whether or not being gay is a choice have anything to do with legalizing gay marriage?
    I agree with what Alastor said on this but would like to add that if homosexuals are granted "rights and privileges" based on lifestyle choices then it sets a precedent that can be utilized by folks who have what is now considered unnatural lifestyles to claim the same legitimacy. Keep in mind that this conversation would have never taken place a hundred years ago. What happens a hundred years from now? Do we legitimize everyones lifetyles simply because there is a small group who wishes some aberrant lifestyle to be legitimized?

    Again, if homosexuality is ever proven conclusively to be "natural", in as much as people are born homosexual, then they do deserve the same rights as heterosexuals. My contention is that this hasn't been proven.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sean_H View Post
    What you said about homosexuality being the law makes literally no sense, you will never be forced to have a relationship with a male.
    Understood. I asked "what if?"

    Much like we do to gays now, where at times it's outright illegal to be gay, and even in the best of circumstances there are substantial economic and legal ramifications for being so.

    What if roles were reversed?

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    I've been wondering...

    If my understanding of how the system currently stands is correct, state and federal governments currently use legal marriages as a guide to distribute tax rebates and such, with (I assume) the goal of promoting a stable households - Or something of the likeI've been wondering...

    If my understanding of how the system currently stands is correct, state and federal governments currently use legal marriages as a guide to distribute tax rebates and such, with (I assume) the goal of promoting a stable households - Or something of the like…

    Or at least, I understand that such was the goal in the past, as stable households were seen to provide better child-rearing environments, better citizens, etc.

    This, IMO, should still be the goal.

    Not as in the past, promoting only heterosexual families and such, but rather with the core goal of promoting a stable citizenry and such.

    Which is one of the reasons I support a more distinct separation of the religious and legal sides of the current marriage system.

    If an obvious divorce between the two can be made, much less turmoil will occur if the government grants tax breaks and such to a multi-person union of 3 males and 5 females supporting 15 children, with one of the males and three of the females being bi, two of the females and one of the males being gay, and one of the males being fully heterosexual – For example.



    If this were tried in the current system, great public outcry would occur, however warranted.

    But if a system could be devised that obviously was directed towards the goals previously mentioned, I think far fewer would have issue.

    This idea is one of the reasons I would like to see a much more obvious split between religious and legal unions.

    Perhaps I could have been more clear...but meh.
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  6. #1546
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    I agree with what Alastor said on this but would like to add that if homosexuals are granted "rights and privileges" based on lifestyle choices then it sets a precedent that can be utilized by folks who have what is now considered unnatural lifestyles to claim the same legitimacy. Keep in mind that this conversation would have never taken place a hundred years ago. What happens a hundred years from now? Do we legitimize everyones lifetyles simply because there is a small group who wishes some aberrant lifestyle to be legitimized?

    Again, if homosexuality is ever proven conclusively to be "natural", in as much as people are born homosexual, then they do deserve the same rights as heterosexuals. My contention is that this hasn't been proven.
    What "could" happen 100 years from now is not a good reason to deny people the right to enter into a civil marriage with each other. 100 years ago we wouldn't have had interracial marriages either.

    Also, you are still arguing under the false premise that because it might be a choice, that homosexuals are not being discriminated against because of it. This is wrong. Our discrimination laws clearly cover religion as protected against discrimination, and there is no doubt that religion is a choice. The argument you really must make is if there is a legitimate reason for that discrimination, such as homosexuality would be harmful to someone in the relationship or even someone outside the relationship(must be able to prove the harm) or that there is a unique government benefit that every heterosexual couple that is allowed to marry provides society, that homosexual couples do not. If you can't prove these, then the discrimination is unjust and wrong.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alastor View Post
    Understood. I asked "what if?"

    Much like we do to gays now, where at times it's outright illegal to be gay, and even in the best of circumstances there are substantial economic and legal ramifications for being so.

    What if roles were reversed?
    Coincidentally enough, I watched that scenario play out on a rerun of South Park last night, where Kyle was discriminated against for not being a metrosexual and the "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy" dudes turned out to actually be crab people.

    The chant at South Park's "metrosexual rally" cracked me up:

    "We're here, we're not queer
    but we're close! Get used to it!"



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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    Coincidentally enough, I watched that scenario play out on a rerun of South Park last night, where Kyle was discriminated against for not being a metrosexual and the "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy" dudes turned out to actually be crab people.

    The chant at South Park's "metrosexual rally" cracked me up:

    "We're here, we're not queer
    but we're close! Get used to it!"


    I love that episode. It is so funny.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  9. #1549
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    I've been wondering...

    If my understanding of how the system currently stands is correct, state and federal governments currently use legal marriages as a guide to distribute tax rebates and such, with (I assume) the goal of promoting a stable households - Or something of the likeI've been wondering...

    If my understanding of how the system currently stands is correct, state and federal governments currently use legal marriages as a guide to distribute tax rebates and such, with (I assume) the goal of promoting a stable households - Or something of the like…

    Or at least, I understand that such was the goal in the past, as stable households were seen to provide better child-rearing environments, better citizens, etc.

    This, IMO, should still be the goal.

    Not as in the past, promoting only heterosexual families and such, but rather with the core goal of promoting a stable citizenry and such.

    Which is one of the reasons I support a more distinct separation of the religious and legal sides of the current marriage system.

    If an obvious divorce between the two can be made, much less turmoil will occur if the government grants tax breaks and such to a multi-person union of 3 males and 5 females supporting 15 children, with one of the males and three of the females being bi, two of the females and one of the males being gay, and one of the males being fully heterosexual – For example.



    If this were tried in the current system, great public outcry would occur, however warranted.

    But if a system could be devised that obviously was directed towards the goals previously mentioned, I think far fewer would have issue.

    This idea is one of the reasons I would like to see a much more obvious split between religious and legal unions.

    Perhaps I could have been more clear...but meh.
    Exactly my point really. Why is polygamy illegal in the US? If a man is married to two consenting females, or vice versa, who's to say that is wrong?

  10. #1550
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    Coincidentally enough, I watched that scenario play out on a rerun of South Park last night, where Kyle was discriminated against for not being a metrosexual and the "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy" dudes turned out to actually be crab people.

    The chant at South Park's "metrosexual rally" cracked me up:

    "We're here, we're not queer
    but we're close! Get used to it!"


    I saw that episode last night too, too funny!

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