View Poll Results: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

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    186 43.26%
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Thread: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

  1. #1521
    Educator Alastor's Avatar
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    They are linked to statements which you have not read in their entirety. All those studies state there there are indications that there may be a link to genetics but to date it's not been able to be proven.
    In other words, there is no credible source that you would accept. Fair enough. We'll simply have to agree to disagree.

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    Irrelevant Pissant

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Sexual orientation probably is not determined by any one factor but by a combination of genetic, hormonal, and environmental influences.
    Hold up. So the fact that it is a combination of genetic, hormonal and environmental influences means that it isn't a choice how exactly? Following that criteria, what IS a choice? Is the preference for pepper jack over swiss not a combination of genetic, hormonal and environmental factors? What other factors are there? How about the preference for sprite over 7up? genetic, hormonal, and environmental factors influence every choice we make.

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    Educator Alastor's Avatar
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Panache View Post
    Hold up. So the fact that it is a combination of genetic, hormonal and environmental influences means that it isn't a choice how exactly? Following that criteria, what IS a choice? Is the preference for pepper jack over swiss not a combination of genetic, hormonal and environmental factors? What other factors are there? How about the preference for sprite over 7up? genetic, hormonal, and environmental factors influence every choice we make.
    True. Some preferences are stronger than others, however.

    To what extent genetics factors in would vary by person I suspect, and it'd be something that anyone other than that person could never truly understand the power of. Whether it was a deeply compelling preference or a mild preference is something we're not in a position to lay judgement upon. I don't think we're in a position to judge to what extent the genetic preferences matter.

    What we can tell is that genetics do indeed matter.

  4. #1524
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    A question regarding the recent discussion: How does whether or not being gay is a choice have anything to do with legalizing gay marriage?
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    A question regarding the recent discussion: How does whether or not being gay is a choice have anything to do with legalizing gay marriage?
    It has absolutely no relevance whatsoever.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alastor View Post
    True. Some preferences are stronger than others, however.

    To what extent genetics factors in would vary by person I suspect, and it'd be something that anyone other than that person could never truly understand the power of. Whether it was a deeply compelling preference or a mild preference is something we're not in a position to lay judgement upon. I don't think we're in a position to judge to what extent the genetic preferences matter.

    What we can tell is that genetics do indeed matter.
    Well duh. I have little doubt that genetics influence what brand of clothes you like to wear too, or what type music you like to listen to. That doesn't make it something other than a lifestyle choice.

  7. #1527
    Educator Alastor's Avatar
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    A question regarding the recent discussion: How does whether or not being gay is a choice have anything to do with legalizing gay marriage?
    Well, it does matter. I disagree with Panache on this.

    It matters because if it's genetic, it undermines a considerable chunk of the Bible, which frankly, can't tolerate much more debunking.

    If this argument is undermined, the church stands to lose a great deal of authority, power, economic resources, credibility, influence and support. It would be a pretty devastating blow to the church.

    As a result, the church itself has a vested interest in preventing the scientific evidence from being accepted by the general population, and standing firmly against gay marriage.

    So I disagree with Panache. The two interests (the church and genetic catalysts to homosexuality) do indeed contradict each other. Not as an act of nature or logic, but rather as a pragmatic of the circumstance.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Panache View Post
    Well duh. I have little doubt that genetics influence what brand of clothes you like to wear too, or what type music you like to listen to. That doesn't make it something other than a lifestyle choice.
    Genetics also determines my preference in women that I find to be sexually attractive. Some women just don't do it for me. Some do. That's a pretty powerful influence.

    Genetics also determines whether or not I can tolerate the taste of certain foods. Just because I'm not alergic to them doesn't mean I don't think they're disgusting. Oysters are a good example for me personally. If I had to eat those every day, I'd probably come pretty close to starving.

    On the contrary, I LOVE BBQ ribs. If I smell them I go nuts and pretty much will do whatever I can to get some within the realm of reason.

    Genetics determines all sorts of things, including who I am compatible with for feelings of love and in some cases hate.


    In some cases it's a simple and mundane preference - Pepsi versus Coke. In other cases however, the genetics that we each carry can be pretty damned compelling.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alastor View Post
    Well, it does matter. I disagree with Panache on this.

    It matters because if it's genetic, it undermines a considerable chunk of the Bible, which frankly, can't tolerate much more debunking.

    If this argument is undermined, the church stands to lose a great deal of authority, power, economic resources, credibility, influence and support. It would be a pretty devastating blow to the church.

    As a result, the church itself has a vested interest in preventing the scientific evidence from being accepted by the general population, and standing firmly against gay marriage.

    So I disagree with Panache. The two interests (the church and genetic catalysts to homosexuality) do indeed contradict each other. Not as an act of nature or logic, but rather as a pragmatic of the circumstance.
    Where do you get the idea that a gay gene would somehow undermine the bible? Does the bible say somewhere that it isn't a genetic trait?

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alastor View Post
    Genetics also determines my preference in women that I find to be sexually attractive. Some women just don't do it for me. Some do. That's a pretty powerful influence.

    Genetics also determines whether or not I can tolerate the taste of certain foods. Just because I'm not alergic to them doesn't mean I don't think they're disgusting. Oysters are a good example for me personally. If I had to eat those every day, I'd probably come pretty close to starving.

    On the contrary, I LOVE BBQ ribs. If I smell them I go nuts and pretty much will do whatever I can to get some within the realm of reason.

    Genetics determines all sorts of things, including who I am compatible with for feelings of love and in some cases hate.


    In some cases it's a simple and mundane preference - Pepsi versus Coke. In other cases however, the genetics that we each carry can be pretty damned compelling.
    Okaaaay... so you are saying that lifestyle choices don't exist?

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