View Poll Results: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

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Thread: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

  1. #991
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by sweEt Mauritius View Post
    But you support civil unions...?? Surely they make it more normalized than it would otherwise be. Both civil unions and civil marriage legitimize and normalize it to different degrees. If you're against normalizing it at all, then I don't understand why you claim to support civil unions.
    Civil unions are nothing more than a civil contract recognized by the state. That’s it, no implications or justifying of sin. Holy matrimony is not in any way the same thing. It is a union brought together by God, not the state.

    Quote Originally Posted by sweEt Mauritius View Post
    Um, exactly... that's what a legal marriage is, getting recognized by the state... It has nothing to do with religion because atheists can get legally married. Again, that's the separation between church and state. You don't need to be religious to get equal state benefits.
    Does not make it right, as I said it is the way our system is and we have to work within the system.

    Quote Originally Posted by sweEt Mauritius View Post
    YOU are denying it. In YOUR church you can't get married without a legal marriage license maybe, but you can't assume that that is true for every single religion practiced by the more than 300,000,000 people in the U.S. Religions are free to establish their own requirements for their own marriages that are recognized by their own churches. And they are not forced by the government to recognize all civil marriages.
    No I am not. You cannot have a legally recognized marriage without a license from the state, period. This goes for any state and any religion. Without it the best you can get is a common law marriage after having lived together for so many years. The amount of time again depends on the state.

    Quote Originally Posted by sweEt Mauritius View Post
    So correct me if I'm wrong, but according to this and the rest of your post, you essentially believe that everyone should be forced to follow your religious beliefs because you believe them to be right and it's your duty to make them the laws that everyone has to follow, whether they believe in your God or not.
    That is over simplified, and no. It is not about forcing anyone to do anything. Unless you want to force Christians to accept things they see as morally wrong.

    We have a secular government that cannot pass laws based on religion. This of course does not mean the people cannot vote based on their own moral code even if religious. This is what I am referring to.

    I am under no restriction when it comes to supporting laws or idea’s I see as right or wrong. No such thing as a sin that is OK. In the end it is still wrong and I and many others will not support or condone this.

    Quote Originally Posted by sweEt Mauritius View Post
    If you want to preach that people are sinning, be my guest. But you DO NOT have the right to enshrine your religious beliefs that I don't agree with into my laws that I have to obey. Again, the problem is that not everyone in this country follows your religion!
    If I am not willing to follow the laws in the Bible, I would be a hypocrite to expect anyone else to do the same. This is also a sin.

    Quote Originally Posted by sweEt Mauritius View Post
    Think of it this way. No one is restricting your right to practice your religious beliefs. But you are trying to restrict other people's rights to practice their own beliefs. And that's not acceptable.
    No right exists for two men or women to marry the same sex as far as I know. Now if the state wants to grant that power via a civil union, I am OK with that. But don’t try and tell me a same sex couple is a marriage, it’s not.

    PS I noticed you ignored my prostitute comment? What about polygamy etc?
    Last edited by Black Dog; 06-09-10 at 09:04 PM.
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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Are you including lesbians in your summation?
    Yes, but lesbians much less so.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    No they don't. Your statement is false, and not based on any kind of fact.
    Its not a fact that male queers have anal sex? Its not a fact that the anus isn't designed for sex and is easily damaged? Its not a fact that the anus is full of excrement, which is up to 50% live bacteria by weight?

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    Unhealthy? Evidence of how their sexual acts or more unhealthy than heteros that practice the same acts please, otherwise, you should be trying to not allow heteros that engage in anal and oral the right to be married as well, right?

    Perverted? Opinionated rubbish...
    I'm perverted, yet you advocate queer sex, even for non-queers. Kindly explain your logic.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Man View Post
    Its not a fact that male queers have anal sex? Its not a fact that the anus isn't designed for sex and is easily damaged? Its not a fact that the anus is full of excrement, which is up to 50% live bacteria by weight?
    Is it not a fact that many hetrosexual couples (or groups) have anal sex?
    Education.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Man View Post
    I'm perverted, yet you advocate queer sex, even for non-queers. Kindly explain your logic.
    You do realize that the sex acts performed by gays are also performed by a large portion of the strait community? You do realize that many gays do not have penetrative sex?
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Is it not a fact that many hetrosexual couples (or groups) have anal sex?
    When heteros engage in queer sex acts they are indeed engaging in unhealthy sexual practices. I'm sorry but I don't see your point.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    You do realize that many gays do not have penetrative sex?
    Good for them.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Man View Post
    When heteros engage in queer sex acts they are indeed engaging in unhealthy sexual practices. I'm sorry but I don't see your point.
    What part of mutual masturbation is unhealthy? Just how unhealthy is oral sex?
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Gay Marriage, is it right to stop it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Civil unions are nothing more than a civil contract recognized by the state. That's it, no implications or justifying of sin. Holy matrimony is not in any way the same thing. It is a union brought together by God, not the state.
    That's. exactly. what. a. civil. marriage. is. A civil contract recognized by the state. And I feel like I'm repeating myself over and over again. This is a discussion of civil marriages recognized under the law. This is NOT a discussion about a union brought together by God. Sacramental marriage is a union brought together by God. Civil marriage, which is what we are discussing, is a union brought together by the state. That's why I don't understand why you keep bringing up holy matrimony and religious reasons. If you oppose secular gay marriage, you should have a legitimate secular reason. My whole point is that holy matrimony IS separate from civil marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Does not make it right, as I said it is the way our system is and we have to work within the system.
    That doesn't make what right? Atheists getting married under secular law and receiving legal benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    No I am not. You cannot have a legally recognized marriage without a license from the state, period. This goes for any state and any religion. Without it the best you can get is a common law marriage after having lived together for so many years. The amount of time again depends on the state.
    I'm honestly confused about what point you're trying to make. Having a legally recognized marriage by definition means you have a license from the state. There is a separation of church and state though because: 1) I can be legally married (with a license from the state) without proof of a religious marriage 2) I can receive sacramental marriage without being legally married (a fundamental Mormon wedding including more than two people could be a sacramental marriage without being recognized by the government with a separate civil marriage license). How can you argue against that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    That is over simplified, and no. It is not about forcing anyone to do anything. Unless you want to force Christians to accept things they see as morally wrong.

    We have a secular government that cannot pass laws based on religion. This of course does not mean the people cannot vote based on their own moral code even if religious. This is what I am referring to.

    I am under no restriction when it comes to supporting laws or ideas I see as right or wrong. No such thing as a sin that is OK. In the end it is still wrong and I and many others will not support or condone this.
    By voting for laws that are drenched in your own religious values and morals, you are forcing people to comply with them. You seem to just ignore the fact that other people have different religious beliefs than you, and that they deserve as much respect as yours. You think something is wrong that other people may not agree. Other people may think something is wrong that you don't think are, and it would be unfair to you for them to vote those beliefs into law simply because THEY belief that it is right. An American Muslim who believes that women should wear veils may think women who don't are sinning, but in good conscience they should not vote for laws that force women to wear veils or face legal consequences. It's the same thing with your views.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    No right exists for two men or women to marry the same sex as far as I know. Now if the state wants to grant that power via a civil union, I am OK with that. But dont try and tell me a same sex couple is a marriage, its not.
    Really? Because that exact right does exists in several nations, states, and municipalities around the world.

    The fundamental problem I have with your arguments are that they seem to suggest that your views are the only correct ones and the only ones that deserve to be respected. When you say "don't tell me a same-sex couple is marriage, it's not," do you not understand that to other people, it is? It's not to you because, correct me if I'm wrong, your religion says it isn't. Well, there are churches where same-sex couples ARE in fact marriage, and there are Americans who DO view same-sex couples as marriage. Where are their rights? Your rights are not restricted if same-sex marriages are legalized. But other people's rights are restricted if they are banned.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    PS I noticed you ignored my prostitute comment? What about polygamy etc?
    Sorry, I must have lost it in the shuffle lol. I don't think prostitution should be illegal, in fact, because people have the freedom to do with their bodies what they like. There's no one else affected by that decision so it should be the person's decision if they choose to be a prostitute. My personal views, which are admittedly based in my religious upbringing, are that being a prostitute is a sinful occupation. But sinful by MY definition does not equal sinful to everyone, and it should not equal illegal for everyone. If they are coerced into prostitution that is different, but only because I have a problem with coercion. Polygamy within a religious context should be legal because of the separation of church and state. But there are serious legal obstacles in state recognition of a polygamist marriage. I mean, how would you work out things like child custody, inheritance, taxes, etc. if everyone in the union were to be treated equally, especially if there were no limit to the number of "spouses" able to enter into the union? People could create giant unions of millions of people. So I'm against legal polygamist marriage because I just honestly don't know how that would even be possible.
    Last edited by sweEt Mauritius; 06-09-10 at 09:59 PM.

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