View Poll Results: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

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  • Yes they should be able to favor one religion in a divorce dispute

    13 20.00%
  • Each parent should be allowed to expose the child to their respective faiths

    26 40.00%
  • The court should butt out of disputes of a religious nature

    18 27.69%
  • The parents should have thought of this ahead of time.

    4 6.15%
  • Other, please explain

    4 6.15%
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Thread: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

  1. #101
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    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    Children should not be made to go to church when they are too young to make the decision for themselves, but no I don't want a court to give preferential treatment to one parents religion over another.
    Last edited by LiveUninhibited; 04-29-10 at 05:05 AM.

  2. #102
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    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    Quote Originally Posted by LiveUninhibited View Post
    Children should not be made to go to church when they are too young to make the decision for themselves, but no I don't want a court to give preferential treatment to one parents religion over another.
    Children should not be made to go to school when they are too young to make the decision for themselves.
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  3. #103
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    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vader View Post
    The fact that the judge is jewish says alot. The fact that the judge set an order that is completely illegal per the 1st Amendment of the U.S. Constitution says even more.

    This is beyond normal incompetence. That judge has proven his judgement is skewed. At the very least he needs to be removed from the bench.
    The judge being Jewish doesn't say anything to me. Would you be inclined to say the same if the judge was female? Judges are impartial.

    The Mother must have requested the restraining order. The judge signed the order. The restraining order was only in effect for 30 days. He could have waited.

    Should this be turned around into his favor, then that's how it should be, however, his lawyer should have petitioned the court to drop the order. The Father should not have defiantly dis-obeyed the order. That usually doesn't work out very well.
    Last edited by d0gbreath; 04-29-10 at 10:15 AM.
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  4. #104
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    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vader View Post
    The fact that the judge is jewish says alot.
    That fact that you said that says alot.

    The fact that the judge set an order that is completely illegal per the 1st Amendment of the U.S. Constitution says even more.
    Yes, it says the judge knows alot more about the law than you do.

  5. #105
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    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vader View Post
    And that is a serious conflict of interest. The judge issued an order that violates the United States Constitution; as such, that judge needs to be disbarred.
    I think she meant that later a Jewish judge gave the father his right to take the child to Church. So, she was, indeed, impartial.

  6. #106
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    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    In general, no. Each parent has the right to expose the child to whatever religious upbringing they want to expose them to. The only exception I would argue would be when the health of the child is at risk. If one parent belonged to a fundamentalist sect that believed in handling venomous snakes, for example, or which refused medical treatment, then certainly, the court, divorce or not, ought to restrict any minor to be raised in such a surrounding.

    Otherwise, the difference between Jewish and Catholic beliefs, neither is physically harmful to the child (mentally is another matter), so no, let the kid realize both are a load of hooey on their own.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  7. #107
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    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    Quote Originally Posted by MyOwnDrum View Post
    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    What's your opinion? Here's the story:
    Problem one: a legal system that still encourages many parents to treat the children as prizes and weapons by which to get revenge over the other.

    Problem two: judges who fail to act "in the best interests of the children" they are supposed to represent.

    Problem three: the legal system supposed to protect children's rights is a gravy train for lawyers and judges to keep hostilities going.

    Why is it that this type of thing happens in the US and UK where divorce is about custody and the parent's "rights" to do things or prevent the other parent doing things - in comparison to the Scandinavian countries where divorce still happens but you only go to court to prevent contact and few divorces end up in court process?

    What I think and would like is more cases such as in the Scandinavian countries where the expectation is not "who owns the child" but how do we arrange contact and child care in a mutually beneficial way for the child's sake. Divorcing parents there are culturally inclined to think about making beneficial agreements without any court involvement than they are here in the UK or US where court is the first and last step.

    With regards to the story - both parents are using the poor child and they are not helped by judges and child law in the US which is less about the child's benefits that keeping judges and lawyers in gainful employment.

  8. #108
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    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    That fact that you said that says alot.
    Yeah ... it says I do not like a biased jewish judge making illegal decisions.

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Yes, it says the judge knows alot more about the law than you do.
    Apparently not ... because his order violates the US Constitution. I can see this ... I am shocked that he was unable to. Why? Because he failed to prevent his religious bias from making his decisions.

  9. #109
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    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    Quote Originally Posted by MyOwnDrum View Post
    I think she meant that later a Jewish judge gave the father his right to take the child to Church. So, she was, indeed, impartial.
    If that is what she meant, maybe so; however, I do not believe that is what occurred. I believe a dishonest judge entered an order that violated the 1st Amendment of the United States Constitution.

    Given the fact that the party seeking the restraining order is jewish, the judge is jewish and the fact that the judge issued a restraining order that prevented the child from going to a non-jewish church is EXTREMELY unethical and an ABSOLUTE violation of the 1st Amendment of the US Constitution.

    The issuing judge needs to be removed from the bench and disbarred. We cannot allow religiously biased judges to make decisions which are ABSOLUTELY in violation of the 1st Amendment of the United States Constitution.
    Last edited by Vader; 04-30-10 at 01:16 AM.

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    Re: Should a divorce court be able to forbid one parent to take a child to church?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mickey Shane View Post
    The judge being Jewish doesn't say anything to me. Would you be inclined to say the same if the judge was female? Judges are impartial.
    The judge is jewish and he issued an illegal restaining order that prevented the child from being exposed to any religious education other than Jewish. This is a SERIOUS ethical violation and it is a HUGE and INEXCUSABLE violation of the 1st Amendment.

    In the legal arena ... even the APPEARENCE of impropriaty is very very bad. When a jewish judge issues an order in favor a a jewish litigant that restrains the 1st Amendment rights of ANYBODY that judge is corrupt and needs to be removed from the bench and the practice of law.

    If you cannot see the issue here, I suggest you take the blinders off.

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Should this be turned around into his favor, then that's how it should be, however, his lawyer should have petitioned the court to drop the order. The Father should not have defiantly dis-obeyed the order. That usually doesn't work out very well.
    The order should have been denied on constitutional grounds. The court must remain neutral AT ALL TIMES. When the court does what this one did it is NOT neutral.

    When the court does not remain neutral justice is unfairly denied.

    The behavior of the judge in question is inexcusable and his career needs to end.
    Last edited by Vader; 04-30-10 at 01:17 AM.

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