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Affirmative Action

Is affirmative action necessary in today's society?

  • Yes, it bridges the disparity between minority and non-minority students and workers

    Votes: 5 8.5%
  • Yes, it is important for the social welfare and diversity of the country

    Votes: 4 6.8%
  • No, it encourages individuals to identify themselves as "disadvantaged"

    Votes: 25 42.4%
  • No, it provides a basis for "reverse-discrimination"

    Votes: 34 57.6%
  • No, it is devalues the accomplishments of both those who it benefits and those it does not

    Votes: 31 52.5%
  • It is necessary for gender, but not race

    Votes: 2 3.4%
  • It is necessary for race, but not gender

    Votes: 1 1.7%
  • Other, please specify

    Votes: 9 15.3%

  • Total voters
    59
I know we are not our multiple great grandparents but what are we trying to do to wipe out racism and make it better? I have to say that Affirmative Action is one of the ways?
So how does giving a job to a black guy over a racist white guy make the racist white guy any less racist?
 
And is that because they're black or because they have babies at the age of 15? They make their own choices. There's nothing in society today keeping them down except themselves.

notable in that you refuse to recognize that whites are the biggest recipients of federal welfare
so, why is it the white female has a net worth of $42,000 and the black counterpart's net worth is $5
try blaming the victim one more time
 
yes, good idea, punish an entire race for the crimes of a minority within that race.

Give me a break. Affirmative Action is not some way to punish the poor ole white skinned in this country. It is a way to make sure that there is a check and balance in place. Maybe saying it like that will make you understand this. :doh

So some of you wish to go back to the days where you cannot hire someone based on skin color, gender or age? Really? Is that what you want? You better be very careful what your wishes are cause it may blow up in your face. One day the white male folks may need some sort of program like this and we will see what ya have to say about that:)
 
Give me a break. Affirmative Action is not some way to punish the poor ole white skinned in this country. It is a way to make sure that there is a check and balance in place. Maybe saying it like that will make you understand this.
Cry me a river. It may upset some lily white person because a black person got a job over A.A. Guess they/whites shoulda thought about that before they decided to frigging enslave people!:roll:

This is an action in reguards to trying to clean up the mess that the poor ole white man created. :roll:Do I give a crap if this makes some white white collar worker resentful? Hell frigging no. More like How Does It Feel! HA!
So which is it? Punishment or not?
 
Give me a break. Affirmative Action is not some way to punish the poor ole white skinned in this country. It is a way to make sure that there is a check and balance in place. Maybe saying it like that will make you understand this. :doh

So some of you wish to go back to the days where you cannot hire someone based on skin color, gender or age? Really? Is that what you want? You better be very careful what your wishes are cause it may blow up in your face. One day the white male folks may need some sort of program like this and we will see what ya have to say about that:)


I like getting my job on my own merit, not because of the government.
 
notable in that you refuse to recognize that whites are the biggest recipients of federal welfare
so, why is it the white female has a net worth of $42,000 and the black counterpart's net worth is $5
try blaming the victim one more time

Which would be expected since whites make up most of the population. Hence, the designation "majority."

Unfortunately, sometimes it's the victims fault. A black female has more opportunity to get out of the ghetto than a white female.
 
If you aren't aware yet that a large majority of human kind would rather live in squalor than work to get out, you need to experience more.

I'm sure they want to get out. They just don't want to work hard enough to do it. And less you think I reek of racism, this applies to all people in the ghetto.

But see I do not buy into this myth that people living in the ghetto do not wish to get out. We need to have more social programs to help them get some kind of job skill training or college, help them with learning how to get a job and also help them with clothing to get that job. Some of them feel stuck and it is the only life they know. We need programs to help expose them to other ways to live and let them know you CAN make it. We also need more mental health programs to help these people deal.

Agree: they want to get out and do not agree with they do not want to work. Are there some that are just lazy ass and do not want to strike a lick? Sure. But in my heart know a lot of them do want to get out but do not know how. They really feel trapped and as if that is their only way. I bet if we could go around and interview people and ask them? I bet at least 85- 90% would say they WANT to get out. The key is figuring out how to get them to DO It.

The living conditions that some of these people are in must have a real play on their self-esteem and they feel worthless, hopeless, etc. They feel trapped. We must find a way to show them they are Worthy of better and we must find a way to get em out if they want out.
 
Give me a break. Affirmative Action is not some way to punish the poor ole white skinned in this country. It is a way to make sure that there is a check and balance in place. Maybe saying it like that will make you understand this. :doh

So some of you wish to go back to the days where you cannot hire someone based on skin color, gender or age? Really? Is that what you want? You better be very careful what your wishes are cause it may blow up in your face. One day the white male folks may need some sort of program like this and we will see what ya have to say about that:)

either way i'm against it, you can't just say that someone deserves an advantage for no reason other than the colour of their skin, its still racial discrimination no matter which way you look at it
 
So which is it? Punishment or not?

I do not see it as punishment but I do get a bit gleeful knowing that it pisses the racist white males off. So sue me:2razz:

BTW, your not replying to the rest of my post is telling. I will give it to ya again:

So some of you wish to go back to the days where you cannot hire someone based on skin color, gender or age? Really? Is that what you want? You better be very careful what your wishes are cause it may blow up in your face. One day the white male folks may need some sort of program like this and we will see what ya have to say about that.


So lets hear what ya have to say about that?
 
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I do not see it as punishment but I do get a bit gleeful knowing that it pisses the racist white males off. So sue me:2razz:
What about the non-racist ones? Do you think AA only affects racists?
BTW, your not replying to the rest of my post is telling.
Telling of what?
I will give it to ya again:

So some of you wish to go back to the days where you cannot hire someone based on skin color, gender or age? Really? Is that what you want? You better be very careful what your wishes are cause it may blow up in your face. One day the white male folks may need some sort of program like this and we will see what ya have to say about that.


So lets hear what ya have to say about that?
Nothing really, other than that it makes you sound more vindictive than rational. :shrug:
 
Cry me a river. It may upset some lily white person because a black person got a job over A.A. Guess they/whites shoulda thought about that before they decided to frigging enslave people!:roll:

This is an action in reguards to trying to clean up the mess that the poor ole white man created. :roll:Do I give a crap if this makes some white white collar worker resentful? Hell frigging no. More like How Does It Feel! HA!

So you agree with, and even promote, racism and sexism. Excellent. :roll:
 
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So you agree and even promote racism. Excellent. :roll:

i think you are looking at this from a majority position

you view this as taking a job from a white person by a minority

AA requires that minority individual to be as qualified as the white applicant. then, the minority applicant gets the position to incrementally offset the long term disadvantage that minorities have sustained

if the minority applicant is as qualified as the majority applicant, as is required under the law for AA practices to result, why do you find it is wrong to award that job to the fully qualified minority applicant instead of the qualified majority applicant?

for extra credit. what process would you use instead in that circumstance of equal qualifications to award the job?
 
i think you are looking at this from a majority position

you view this as taking a job from a white person by a minority
No. I view it as hiring someone based on their gender and skin color. Which is racist/sexist.

if the minority applicant is as qualified as the majority applicant, as is required under the law for AA practices to result, why do you find it is wrong to award that job to the fully qualified minority applicant instead of the qualified majority applicant?
First off, employers should be allowed to hire whoever the **** they want for whatever reason they want. And the government should not FORCE them to hire someone just because the applicant has tits or a darker skin tone.

for extra credit. what process would you use instead in that circumstance of equal qualifications to award the job?
Personality assessment. That's what *I* do when I'm looking to hire. I don't give a **** what their skin color is, or if they have tits or not. Nor SHOULD I. I hire the person I feel is best for the job. Period. Anything else would be detrimental for my department. And, I should never be forced to hire someone just because of their skin pigmentation or what's between their legs
 
But see I do not buy into this myth that people living in the ghetto do not wish to get out. We need to have more social programs to help them get some kind of job skill training or college, help them with learning how to get a job and also help them with clothing to get that job. Some of them feel stuck and it is the only life they know. We need programs to help expose them to other ways to live and let them know you CAN make it. We also need more mental health programs to help these people deal.

Agree: they want to get out and do not agree with they do not want to work. Are there some that are just lazy ass and do not want to strike a lick? Sure. But in my heart know a lot of them do want to get out but do not know how. They really feel trapped and as if that is their only way. I bet if we could go around and interview people and ask them? I bet at least 85- 90% would say they WANT to get out. The key is figuring out how to get them to DO It.

The living conditions that some of these people are in must have a real play on their self-esteem and they feel worthless, hopeless, etc. They feel trapped. We must find a way to show them they are Worthy of better and we must find a way to get em out if they want out.

No one wants to live in the ghetto. Everyone wants to be a millionaire. What divides those that make it and those that live in poverty with kids by four different guys is desire, not opportunity.

There is absolutely nothing that prevents minorities from doing well in school and being accepted to college except motivation. Affirmative action is detrimental to motivation.
 
No one wants to live in the ghetto. Everyone wants to be a millionaire. What divides those that make it and those that live in poverty with kids by four different guys is desire, not opportunity.

There is absolutely nothing that prevents minorities from doing well in school and being accepted to college except motivation. Affirmative action is detrimental to motivation.

how is AA detrimental to motivation?
 
and what is your excuse for the poor majority citizens who fail if not their culture
this is especially significant recognizing that they represent the largest segment of the population requiring government assistance

They do fail because of their culture. When you get a culture that doesn't value education, where the norm is lots of kids by lots of fathers and the typical means of explaining why they're not doing well is to point fingers at others, that's a massive problem, but you can't actually point out that the culture is bad, the race-baiters like Sharpton will scream that you're a racist.

No, I'm just a realist.
 
how is AA detrimental to motivation?

If you have a leg up from the next guy for something as silly as skin tone, you don't need to try as hard. That's just human nature.

Put another way, if a white, middle class kid wants to go to Harvard, they have to work their ass off and still cross their fingers. A black kid from the ghetto will not need to work as hard, because just checking off "African American" on their application gives them a huge boost.

I'd think it'd be insulting. AA is basically telling the minorities that they can't get in on their own merits. If someone hired me because I was female, I'd quit out of shame.
 
If someone hired me because I was female, I'd quit out of shame.

I was about to say the same thing. If I found out I was hired because I had tits, I'd walk out then and there. I would be insulted beyond belief. (unless of course my job required I had tits LOL)
 
I was about to say the same thing. If I found out I was hired because I had tits, I'd walk out then and there. I would be insulted beyond belief. (unless of course my job required I had tits LOL)

Wet nurse. Gotta have em. :lol:
 
They do fail because of their culture. When you get a culture that doesn't value education, where the norm is lots of kids by lots of fathers and the typical means of explaining why they're not doing well is to point fingers at others, that's a massive problem, but you can't actually point out that the culture is bad, the race-baiters like Sharpton will scream that you're a racist.

where to begin?
so, even tho the largest portion of the welfare budget goes to white recipients, you want to insist that it is the black culture which has a cultural problem ... all the while ignoring the conditions that cause the white welfare recipients to be on the dole
you seem to believe that only black women have children by different fathers. your conclusion is beyond absurd
and you accuse blacks as being the ones to point racially motivated fingers


No, I'm just a realist.
well, we can agree that what you are does begin with an "r" and end with "...ist"
 
If you have a leg up from the next guy for something as silly as skin tone, you don't need to try as hard. That's just human nature.
you keep ignoring an essential element of AA
the individual who benefits from AA MUST be as competent as their majority competitor for the position. the qualifications they must meet are not watered down because they are of a minority race

Put another way, if a white, middle class kid wants to go to Harvard, they have to work their ass off and still cross their fingers. A black kid from the ghetto will not need to work as hard, because just checking off "African American" on their application gives them a huge boost.
you have just illustrated my point above
that black kid had to work to meet the same competence level as the white kid. if they did not have the same level of attainment then the black kid would be excluded from the competition. the race of the applicant is what breaks the tie

I'd think it'd be insulting. AA is basically telling the minorities that they can't get in on their own merits. If someone hired me because I was female, I'd quit out of shame.
as a government employee, and as a woman, i would be very surprised if you did not receive your position because of your gender
not saying you were not competent, you had to be, but saying that the males who also applied were non selected because the award went to a female to balance the past practice of preferring males in the workplace. that's the way AA works. congratulations. you have benefitted from AA. please, don't quit your job just because you are only now made aware of the preference you enjoyed only because of your gender
 
where to begin?
so, even tho the largest portion of the welfare budget goes to white recipients, you want to insist that it is the black culture which has a cultural problem ... all the while ignoring the conditions that cause the white welfare recipients to be on the dole

you would expect that in a country in which 80% of the population is white, it's an invalid argument, unless whites make up more than 80% of total people in welfare
 
you would expect that in a country in which 80% of the population is white, it's an invalid argument, unless whites make up more than 80% of total people in welfare

what i cannot ignore is someone who insists it is the minority culture which has the evident problem while simultaneously knowing that it is the white culture which is predominently on the dole
 
you keep ignoring an essential element of AA
the individual who benefits from AA MUST be as competent as their majority competitor for the position. the qualifications they must meet are not watered down because they are of a minority race


you have just illustrated my point above
that black kid had to work to meet the same competence level as the white kid. if they did not have the same level of attainment then the black kid would be excluded from the competition. the race of the applicant is what breaks the tie

That's false. Being an African American gives you a 230 point boost in regards to being accepted to an Ivy League school. That means an African American does not have to try as hard to beat a white kid. By the way, that's way higher than a legacy boost, which I'm sure you'll agree mostly goes to rich white kids.

as a government employee, and as a woman, i would be very surprised if you did not receive your position because of your gender
not saying you were not competent, you had to be, but saying that the males who also applied were non selected because the award went to a female to balance the past practice of preferring males in the workplace. that's the way AA works. congratulations. you have benefitted from AA. please, don't quit your job just because you are only now made aware of the preference you enjoyed only because of your gender

That's actually not true in my area. Perhaps in others, but I work on a Marine base. Which means a whole lot of Marine wives looking for a job. There are three males in my office, which is about representational of the number of males free in the workforce. If anything, they would need affirmative action.
 
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