View Poll Results: Is affirmative action necessary in today's society?

Voters
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  • Yes, it bridges the disparity between minority and non-minority students and workers

    6 7.59%
  • Yes, it is important for the social welfare and diversity of the country

    6 7.59%
  • No, it encourages individuals to identify themselves as "disadvantaged"

    35 44.30%
  • No, it provides a basis for "reverse-discrimination"

    50 63.29%
  • No, it is devalues the accomplishments of both those who it benefits and those it does not

    45 56.96%
  • It is necessary for gender, but not race

    2 2.53%
  • It is necessary for race, but not gender

    1 1.27%
  • Other, please specify

    11 13.92%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Affirmative Action

  1. #71
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelzie View Post
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelzie View Post
    If you have a leg up from the next guy for something as silly as skin tone, you don't need to try as hard. That's just human nature.
    you keep ignoring an essential element of AA
    the individual who benefits from AA MUST be as competent as their majority competitor for the position. the qualifications they must meet are not watered down because they are of a minority race

    Put another way, if a white, middle class kid wants to go to Harvard, they have to work their ass off and still cross their fingers. A black kid from the ghetto will not need to work as hard, because just checking off "African American" on their application gives them a huge boost.
    you have just illustrated my point above
    that black kid had to work to meet the same competence level as the white kid. if they did not have the same level of attainment then the black kid would be excluded from the competition. the race of the applicant is what breaks the tie

    I'd think it'd be insulting. AA is basically telling the minorities that they can't get in on their own merits. If someone hired me because I was female, I'd quit out of shame.
    as a government employee, and as a woman, i would be very surprised if you did not receive your position because of your gender
    not saying you were not competent, you had to be, but saying that the males who also applied were non selected because the award went to a female to balance the past practice of preferring males in the workplace. that's the way AA works. congratulations. you have benefitted from AA. please, don't quit your job just because you are only now made aware of the preference you enjoyed only because of your gender
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  3. #73
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    where to begin?
    so, even tho the largest portion of the welfare budget goes to white recipients, you want to insist that it is the black culture which has a cultural problem ... all the while ignoring the conditions that cause the white welfare recipients to be on the dole
    you would expect that in a country in which 80% of the population is white, it's an invalid argument, unless whites make up more than 80% of total people in welfare
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  4. #74
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    you would expect that in a country in which 80% of the population is white, it's an invalid argument, unless whites make up more than 80% of total people in welfare
    what i cannot ignore is someone who insists it is the minority culture which has the evident problem while simultaneously knowing that it is the white culture which is predominently on the dole
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  5. #75
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    you keep ignoring an essential element of AA
    the individual who benefits from AA MUST be as competent as their majority competitor for the position. the qualifications they must meet are not watered down because they are of a minority race


    you have just illustrated my point above
    that black kid had to work to meet the same competence level as the white kid. if they did not have the same level of attainment then the black kid would be excluded from the competition. the race of the applicant is what breaks the tie
    That's false. Being an African American gives you a 230 point boost in regards to being accepted to an Ivy League school. That means an African American does not have to try as hard to beat a white kid. By the way, that's way higher than a legacy boost, which I'm sure you'll agree mostly goes to rich white kids.

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    as a government employee, and as a woman, i would be very surprised if you did not receive your position because of your gender
    not saying you were not competent, you had to be, but saying that the males who also applied were non selected because the award went to a female to balance the past practice of preferring males in the workplace. that's the way AA works. congratulations. you have benefitted from AA. please, don't quit your job just because you are only now made aware of the preference you enjoyed only because of your gender
    That's actually not true in my area. Perhaps in others, but I work on a Marine base. Which means a whole lot of Marine wives looking for a job. There are three males in my office, which is about representational of the number of males free in the workforce. If anything, they would need affirmative action.
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  6. #76
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    you keep ignoring an essential element of AA
    the individual who benefits from AA MUST be as competent as their majority competitor for the position. the qualifications they must meet are not watered down because they are of a minority race
    Yeah, sure. Except for when companies must hire a certain number of minorities.

  7. #77
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    what i cannot ignore is someone who insists it is the minority culture which has the evident problem while simultaneously knowing that it is the white culture which is predominently on the dole
    But you can ignore mathematics obviously. Why don't you try looking at what percentage of blacks are on welfare compared to what percentage of whites are. Compare what percentage of blacks live in the ghetto compared to what percentage of whites. Stop acting like raw data means anything and look at it statistically.

    Oh wait, that might get in the way of your preconceived notions!
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  8. #78
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Here's the problem, and the solution, rolled into one.--simply quit treating people as Groups, and treat them as individuals. We are not a group. And there is no universal group think.
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by Skateguy View Post
    Here's the problem, and the solution, rolled into one.--simply quit treating people as Groups, and treat them as individuals. We are not a group. And there is no universal group think.
    Agreed, but then again, you'd have to stop blacks from referring to themselves as the "black community" wouldn't you?
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba
    you keep ignoring an essential element of AA
    the individual who benefits from AA MUST be as competent as their majority competitor for the position. the qualifications they must meet are not watered down because they are of a minority race
    It may not have been designed like that, but that's exactly how it is in practice. My alma mater's law school (the University of Michigan) had a well-publicized case about letting in minorities with significantly worse scores than whites because of some AA/quota problems. Or the firefighters in New England that had a state Supreme Court rip up promotion-ranking tests because minorities placed at the very bottom under all the whites.

    There are so many other cases, but you have the internet. Feel free to use it.

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