View Poll Results: Is affirmative action necessary in today's society?

Voters
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  • Yes, it bridges the disparity between minority and non-minority students and workers

    6 7.59%
  • Yes, it is important for the social welfare and diversity of the country

    6 7.59%
  • No, it encourages individuals to identify themselves as "disadvantaged"

    35 44.30%
  • No, it provides a basis for "reverse-discrimination"

    50 63.29%
  • No, it is devalues the accomplishments of both those who it benefits and those it does not

    45 56.96%
  • It is necessary for gender, but not race

    2 2.53%
  • It is necessary for race, but not gender

    1 1.27%
  • Other, please specify

    11 13.92%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Affirmative Action

  1. #201
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by Kali View Post
    Getting back to the issue of A.A. I simply cannot wrap my head around the "why" have an issue with it. Lots of people in this thread have made good points and ones I have heard before but it does not change the reality that AA is needed.

    Why can't people understand it is needed? I think think this is the main reason WHY it is still needed is because people do not understand we still have racism.
    The problem is that the AA that is "needed" has nothing in common with the AA that is actually practiced.



  2. #202
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    The problem is that the AA that is "needed" has nothing in common with the AA that is actually practiced.
    I tend to agree. If AA programmes were reorganised to focus on economic deprivation, rather than social group membership, many of the gripes and anomalies would disappear. Of course, there would still be people who believe that society functions just fine without any intervention, but Rivrrat apart I think that widespread public support for such a move would result.
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  3. #203
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    I tend to agree. If AA programmes were reorganised to focus on economic deprivation, rather than social group membership, many of the gripes and anomalies would disappear.
    Instead why don't we base it on your qualifications to do the job? I know that sounds insane, but it mite just work.

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Of course, there would still be people who believe that society functions just fine without any intervention, but Rivrrat apart I think that widespread public support for such a move would result.
    It could not and would not. Being poor has nothing to do with your qualifications to do any job.

    It would be a disaster.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
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  4. #204
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue
    I tend to agree. If AA programmes were reorganised to focus on economic deprivation, rather than social group membership, many of the gripes and anomalies would disappear. Of course, there would still be people who believe that society functions just fine without any intervention, but Rivrrat apart I think that widespread public support for such a move would result.
    Problem - white people aren't immune to poverty. On this side of the pond, we refer to them as "white trash" or "trailer trash". Instead of rap, it's Kid Rock. Instead of malt liquor, it's Budweiser. Instead of basketball, it's NASCAR. Same premise though.

    Should we not help poor white trash though? If strictly based on socioeconomic factors, they'd get help too, and we'd still get screams of racism by entitlement-desiring minorities.

  5. #205
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Affirmative action is just as racist and denying someone a job because they are black. Essentially they are using racism to "fix" a racist (in their wrong opinion) workforce. We should have laws against discrimination, but we shouldn't have policies and incentives pushing more racism in the form of affirmative action. Also, I think it's wrong that there are "black only" scholarships.
    Last edited by digsbe; 04-18-10 at 03:20 PM.

  6. #206
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Affirmative action is just as racist and denying someone a job because they are black. Essentially they are using racism to "fix" a racist (in their wrong opinion) workforce. We should have laws against discrimination, but we should have policies and incentives more pushing racism in the form of affirmative action. Also, I think it's wrong that there are "black only" scholarships.
    Race based scholarships initially were because of the lack of funding for minority's back in the day when they literally had nothing available.

    Now days anyone can set up any scholarship fund for any reason. So it is kind of a dead issue.

    Of course I don't know if their are Federal or state scholarship funds that work this way. If scholarships are based on race by the government, that is wrong. If it is private, no problem at all.
    Last edited by Black Dog; 04-18-10 at 03:22 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  7. #207
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Race based scholarships initially were because of the lack of funding for minority's back in the day when they literally had nothing available.

    Now days anyone can set up any scholarship fund for any reason. So it is kind of a dead issue.
    Even if minorities had nothing they still shouldn't have their own scholarship. Instead they should have made a scholarship for those who are poor regardless of race. We do have the Pell Grant (of which I am a receiver), but we also have scholarships for simply being African American. An ironic thing is that there was a white guy from South Africa who moved to the US. He signed up for the African American scholarship (because technically he is African American) and was denied it because he was white. Would it be racist if there was a whites only scholarship fund? Essentially they are giving free money to those of a certain race, while at the same time denying others that money because of their race and having less in other scholarships because the blacks only scholarship does suck up funding.

  8. #208
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Even if minorities had nothing they still shouldn't have their own scholarship. Instead they should have made a scholarship for those who are poor regardless of race.
    Whites already had a multitude of scholarships not available to minority's. So it would have been pointless. The United Negro college fund for instance was the only one available to blacks at the time, period. So no, your reasoning is flawed for several reasons. Not taking into account the timeline and the Jim Crow era is just one of them.

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    We do have the Pell Grant (of which I am a receiver), but we also have scholarships for simply being African American. An ironic thing is that there was a white guy from South Africa who moved to the US. He signed up for the African American scholarship (because technically he is African American) and was denied it because he was white. Would it be racist if there was a whites only scholarship fund?
    You have to go back a little farther than 1980 to 1990 to understand they why of it. I am not trying to sound condescending, but you are not seeing the forest for the trees.

    If it is a private scholarship it would not be a problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Essentially they are giving free money to those of a certain race, while at the same time denying others that money because of their race and having less in other scholarships because the blacks only scholarship does suck up funding.
    As a private institution they are well within their rights.

    If it is a government institution, well that is a horse of a different color and it is wrong.
    Last edited by Black Dog; 04-18-10 at 03:39 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  9. #209
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by Kali View Post
    Getting back to the issue of A.A. I simply cannot wrap my head around the "why" have an issue with it. Lots of people in this thread have made good points and ones I have heard before but it does not change the reality that AA is needed.

    Why can't people understand it is needed? I think think this is the main reason WHY it is still needed is because people do not understand we still have racism.
    Racism and sexism are needed? Since when?

  10. #210
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    Re: Affirmative Action

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Racism and sexism are needed? Since when?
    Solid.

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