View Poll Results: Does the word democracy upset you?

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  • Yes

    3 11.54%
  • No

    21 80.77%
  • Not Sure

    1 3.85%
  • Other

    1 3.85%
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Thread: Do you get upset at the word democracy?

  1. #91
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    When presidential candidates campaign to win the electoral votes of closely divided battleground states, such as in Ohio and Florida, under the state-by-state winner-take-all rules, the big cities in those battleground states do not receive all the attention, much less control the outcome. Cleveland and Miami certainly did not receive all the attention or control the outcome in Ohio and Florida in 2000 and 2004.

    The population of the top five cities (New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Houston and Philadelphia) is only 6% of the population of the United States and the population of the top 50 cities is only 19% of the population of the United States. Even if one makes the far-fetched assumption that a candidate could win 100% of the votes in the nation's top five cities, he would only have won 6% of the national vote.

  2. #92
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    The National Popular Vote bill

    The National Popular Vote bill would guarantee the Presidency to the candidate who receives the most popular votes in all 50 states (and DC).

    Every vote, everywhere, would be politically relevant and equal in presidential elections. Candidates would need to care about voters across the nation, not just undecided voters in a handful of swing states.

    The bill would take effect only when enacted, in identical form, by states possessing a majority of the electoral votes--that is, enough electoral votes to elect a President (270 of 538). When the bill comes into effect, all the electoral votes from those states would be awarded to the presidential candidate who receives the most popular votes in all 50 states (and DC).

    The bill uses the power given to each state by the Founding Fathers in the Constitution to change how they award their electoral votes for president.

    The bill is currently endorsed by over 1,707 state legislators (in 48 states) who have sponsored and/or cast recorded votes in favor of the bill.

    In Gallup polls since 1944, only about 20% of the public has supported the current system of awarding all of a state's electoral votes to the presidential candidate who receives the most votes in each separate state (with about 70% opposed and about 10% undecided). The recent Washington Post, Kaiser Family Foundation, and Harvard University poll shows 72% support for direct nationwide election of the President. Support for a national popular vote is strong in virtually every state, partisan, and demographic group surveyed in recent polls in closely divided battleground states: Colorado-- 68%, Iowa --75%, Michigan-- 73%, Missouri-- 70%, New Hampshire-- 69%, Nevada-- 72%, New Mexico-- 76%, North Carolina-- 74%, Ohio-- 70%, Pennsylvania -- 78%, Virginia -- 74%, and Wisconsin -- 71%; in smaller states (3 to 5 electoral votes): Alaska 70%, DC 76%, Delaware --75%, Maine -- 77%, Nebraska -- 74%, New Hampshire --69%, Nevada -- 72%, New Mexico -- 76%, Rhode Island -- 74%, and Vermont -- 75%; in Southern and border states: Arkansas --80%, Kentucky -- 80%, Mississippi --77%, Missouri -- 70%, North Carolina -- 74%, and Virginia -- 74%; and in other states polled: California -- 70%, Connecticut -- 74% , Massachusetts -- 73%, Minnesota 75%, New York -- 79%, Washington -- 77%, and West Virginia- 81%.

    The National Popular Vote bill has passed 29 state legislative chambers, in 19 small, medium-small, medium, and large states, including one house in Arkansas, Connecticut, Delaware, Maine, Michigan, Nevada, New Mexico, North Carolina, and Oregon, and both houses in California, Colorado, Hawaii, Illinois, New Jersey, Maryland, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Vermont, and Washington. The bill has been enacted by Hawaii, Illinois, New Jersey, Maryland, and Washington. These five states possess 61 electoral votes -- 23% of the 270 necessary to bring the law into effect.

    See National Popular Vote -- Electoral college reform by direct election of the President

  3. #93
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    Re: Do you get upset at the word democracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    It wasn't invented. Copernicus discovered it behind Neptune in the 4th century.
    Oh, I thought it was invented by Leonardo in 1224 BCE .

  4. #94
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    Re: Do you get upset at the word democracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Flea View Post
    Oh, I thought it was invented by Leonardo in 1224 BCE .
    That's because you don't know basic history. It was Copernicus right after buying Jesus a Whopper at the Beijing McDonalds. The Mayans wrote all about it on the Eiffel Tower right before their language, called graffiti, became lost in history. How embarrassing for you.
    Last edited by MSgt; 04-13-10 at 12:00 AM.

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  5. #95
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    Re: Do you get upset at the word democracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    That's because you don't know basic history. It was Copernicus right after buying Jesus a Whopper at the Beijing McDonalds. The Mayans wrote all about it on the Eiffel Tower right before their language, called graffiti, became lost in history. How embarrassing for you.
    Seriously. Was that part of the 2012 prediction?

  6. #96
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    Re: Do you get upset at the word democracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Flea View Post
    Seriously. Was that part of the 2012 prediction?
    Of that I'm not sure. Although there weren't many Mayans in the movie.

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  7. #97
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    Re: Do you get upset at the word democracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Of that I'm not sure. Although there weren't many Mayans in the movie.
    Apocolypto would have been more apt.

  8. #98
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    Re: Do you get upset at the word democracy?

    People will often say 'this is a democracy, and so...'.

    When they do, they generally fail to understand that in our system of government, the will of the people does not always prevail.

    I believe this is generally due to ignorance, which is sometimes willful.

  9. #99
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    Re: Do you get upset at the word democracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Flea View Post
    The problem is in that the elector does not even need to cast their vote as their constituency wants, as happened in the 2000 election. They are known as "Faithless Electors"

    2000 - Barbara Lett-Simmons (Democrat, District of Columbia)
    In the most recent act of Elector abstention, Barbara Lett-Simmons, a Democratic Elector from the District of Columbia, did not cast her vote for Al Gore as expected. Her abstention was meant to protest the lack of Congressional representation for Washington, DC.


    The Electoral College - "Faithless Electors"


    There is a list of the rest, and that is the problem. The people are not truly represented.
    That's part of the system. The founders weren't comfortable with direct democracy and too much reliance on popular opinion can have devastating effects on a government; so they moved to isolate somewhat the government from the whims of populism. And they were correct.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  10. #100
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    Re: Do you get upset at the word democracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    People will often say 'this is a democracy, and so...'.

    When they do, they generally fail to understand that in our system of government, the will of the people does not always prevail.

    I believe this is generally due to ignorance, which is sometimes willful.
    Give a name of a democracy where the will of people always prevails.

    You're speaking about direct democracy.
    In representative democracy, which is pretty much the only form of democracy that is being used on planet Earth, the will of the people doesn't mean much when we're not on the elections periods.

    One of the main reasons why we favor representative democracy is because we understand that the majority of the people cannot be entrusted with making the right decisions, hence we choose a politician that we believe represents our opinions and pray that he wouldn't turn asshole on us.

    Indeed, the democratic value of "the majority rules" in modern democracies is represented mainly by the elections themselves.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

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