View Poll Results: Which do you Prefer

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  • A purely Socialist economy

    5 6.25%
  • An economy with more Socialism then Capitalism

    10 12.50%
  • An economy with equal Socialist and Capitalist ideas

    12 15.00%
  • An economy with more Capitalism then Socialism

    34 42.50%
  • A purely Capitalist society

    19 23.75%
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Thread: Socialism vs. Capitalism

  1. #61
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    Re: Socialism vs. Capitalism

    One could argue that the auto maker failed because of socialistic policies (unions and auto regulations). If the company fails than it fails, let it die and another will take its place on the market. We shouldn't bail out any struggling or failing business at the taxpayers expense.

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    Re: Socialism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    And regulation is regulation, but how would you define regulation that prevents monopolies...
    This is evidence of the proper role of govermnemt -- that is, protecting the rights of the people from those that would abuse them.

  3. #63
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    Re: Socialism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    One could argue that the auto maker failed because of socialistic policies (unions and auto regulations). If the company fails than it fails, let it die and another will take its place on the market. We shouldn't bail out any struggling or failing business at the taxpayers expense.
    You have a lot of common sense. I like it.

  4. #64
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    Re: Socialism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Originally Posted by Politics101 View Post
    This brings another great point. Under socialism, failure is rewarded with forced taxpayer funding, 'temporarily' of course.
    No, it's not socialism when it's temporary. That's the point. If it were socialism, the government would keep these businesses permanently, and would buy up every failing business out there too. It's not doing either.

    The government is going to MAKE money on the sale of the banks, and maybe GM too. And lots of jobs will be saved.

    If you want to call it temporary socialism in extreme times (to hold off what could have been the worst economic collapse since the Great Depression), you may. Just don't forget the "temporary" part.

  5. #65
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    Re: Socialism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    One could argue that the auto maker failed because of socialistic policies (unions and auto regulations). If the company fails than it fails, let it die and another will take its place on the market. We shouldn't bail out any struggling or failing business at the taxpayers expense.
    99.9999% of failing businesses are still allowed to fail.

    The largest auto manufacturer in the world (I think, maybe not any more) was an exception. So were banks and insurance companies, which could have caused a total meltdown of the entire economy and bring down many many more businesses if they failed. The rest are being allowed to fail just like before. And this is temporary, and the government could actually make a profit for the taxpayers from it.

    Hardly a socialist transformation of America. Not even close.

  6. #66
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    Re: Socialism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    I don't believe I was the one who said the two can't co-exist.
    You're right, sorry.

    And regulation is regulation, but how would you define regulation that prevents monopolies or increases worker wages/treatment? It may not be socialist in the strictest sense, but it certainly isn't raw capitalism.
    It's regulated capitalism, as opposed to laissez-faire capitalism. It's certainly not socialism though. You can oppose regulation if you want, just don't call it socialism.

  7. #67
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    Re: Socialism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Except student loans were already backed by the government, and therefore not really provided solely by private banks anyway.
    Are you saying that removing the private bank therefore provides no change to the method and therefore, the student loans were actually a part of a socialist policy from the start?

    How about the auto makers. Did the government also back the auto makers? AIG? Banks like Wells Fargo?
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: Socialism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    No, it's not socialism when it's temporary.
    Ah...so what's the minimum and maximum time frame then? We need to define what is and is not temporary.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  9. #69
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    Re: Socialism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Ah...so what's the minimum and maximum time frame then? We need to define what is and is not temporary.
    How about when the government buys the majority of the stocks in corporation say Citi, and then sells it a few years later for an $8 billion profit?
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  10. #70
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    Re: Socialism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    How about when the government buys the majority of the stocks in corporation say Citi, and then sells it a few years later for an $8 billion profit?
    I'll be eagerly awaiting my portion of the profits from the 8 billion.

    So you're saying temporary = a few years? Is that >1 but less than 3?

    And what if (since we're working in hypotheticals) the government doesn't sell the majority stock in >1 but less than 3 years and continues to own it for say 9 years, with a promise to sell it in the "near future" (another nice vague qualifier).

    And why does the government buy, with tax payer money, a majority stock in a private company in the first place? What's the end goal and strategic plan?


    My point, if you didn't already know, is that there's a separation between private and public sectors. Using a vague term like "temporary" without defining what temporary is - or, defining what is temporary and then RE-DEFINING it every so often so that "temporary" has no consistent or definable meaning, would be a socialist policy move.
    Last edited by Ockham; 04-01-10 at 02:02 PM. Reason: Added first sentence
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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