View Poll Results: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights?

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  • A license/permit required to exercise certain or all 1st amendment rights

    6 15.79%
  • A license/permit required to exercise certain or all 2nd amendment rights

    22 57.89%
  • Registration requirement of some or all of your books and other 1st amendment related things

    2 5.26%
  • Registration requirement of some or all of your firearms and other weapons.

    30 78.95%
  • A ban on certain books,religions, what the press can report and etc.

    3 7.89%
  • A ban on certain weapons.

    24 63.16%
  • A ban on certain individuals from exercising 1st amendment rights

    3 7.89%
  • A ban on certain individuals form exercising 2nd amendment rights

    17 44.74%
  • A total ban on 1st amendment rights

    2 5.26%
  • A total ban on 2nd amendment rights

    3 7.89%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights?

  1. #201
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    Re: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights

    Well, as it turns out, I have yet to respond to this thread...

    What first comes to mind when seeing the poll question, namely:
    What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights?
    The first thought I have is "None!", but I shall proceed to examine each possible poll answer.
    I take it as a given that there are as many opinions as to what those two amendments mean/are meant to mean/restrict/whatever as there are people.
    Mine will be partially displayed here.

    A license/permit required to exercise certain or all 1st amendment rights
    No. Not a good idea. I would think the majority of US citizens are of the opinion that any infringement on 1st amendment rights is a bad thing.
    A license/permit required to exercise certain or all 2nd amendment rights
    Now, here I think some very limited permit/license might be useful. Punishing violent criminals by taking away their rights to some or all weapons seems reasonable.
    Restrictions based on mental conditions seems a very gray area to me.
    All other persons should have no restrictions, at most a 5ish min background check to ensure they are not a violent criminal, after which they can purchase the weapon.
    Restrictions on who can carry concealed seem another gray area. What part of the constitution supports such?
    Restrictions on how one can store, transport, and otherwise deal with a firearm they own seem another gray area. What part of the constitution supports such?
    Registration requirement of some or all of your books and other 1st amendment related things
    No. But I am sure some people want to restrict books that describe some things (what specific things depends on the person). Books never hurt anyone, but people getting ideas from books might. Is that the books fault? Or the persons?
    Registration requirement of some or all of your firearms and other weapons.
    While I am opposed to this in some respects, the idea of preventing violent criminals from legally owning firearms seems reasonable, so a quick check to see if you are one...
    A ban on certain books, religions, what the press can report and etc.
    No. Blatant violation of 1st amendment.
    A ban on certain weapons.
    Possibly a violation of the 2nd amendment. Opinions on what the 2nd amendment's wording mean are many and varied.
    A ban on certain individuals from exercising 1st amendment rights
    No. That would probably violate several other amendments, not to mention the 1st.
    A ban on certain individuals form exercising 2nd amendment rights
    As noted above, I find the removal of the firearm ownership right from violent criminals seems reasonable. Any other limitation would need very careful examination.
    Additionally, the precise meaning of "2nd amendment rights" is constantly in dispute, if not in the courts, in the minds and thoughts of many persons.
    A total ban on 1st amendment rights
    Nah, that would probably violate the 1st amendment.../sarcasm
    A total ban on 2nd amendment rights
    Nah, that would probably violate the 2nd amendment.../sarcasm
    Education.

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  2. #202
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    Re: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    While I am opposed to this in some respects, the idea of preventing violent criminals from legally owning firearms seems reasonable, so a quick check to see if you are one...
    How would a firearm registration prevent a violent criminal from owning a firearm? Wouldn't a violent criminal get his gun from a private owner or through illegals means?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  3. #203
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    Re: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    How would a firearm registration prevent a violent criminal from owning a firearm? Wouldn't a violent criminal get his gun from a private owner or through illegal means?
    Well, possibly, although some might try to buy one, which is why I said:

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    While I am opposed to this in some respects, the idea of preventing violent criminals from legally owning firearms seems reasonable, so a quick check to see if you are one...
    Bold blue emphasis added...
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  4. #204
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    Re: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    You know, we should go watch a movie together sometime. I might feel like yelling, "fire" and if you happen to die in a stampede...well, I was inside my 1st amendment rights
    That isn't an exercise of your 1st amendment rights. That is milicious mischief and rendering of a false alarm. Both of which are punishable by jail time.

    If somebody dies as a result, then it's a felony punishable by a life sentence (in most states).

  5. #205
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    Re: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights

    Quote Originally Posted by Vader View Post
    That isn't an exercise of your 1st amendment rights. That is milicious mischief and rendering of a false alarm. Both of which are punishable by jail time.

    If somebody dies as a result, then it's a felony punishable by a life sentence (in most states).
    Kind of. It's actually willful endangerment on face if malicious intent can't be proven. The history of where rights end is pretty interesting though, and the thing most people don't seem to understand is that rights all pretty much end in the same way; Time Place Manner.

    For instance, owning an automatic.....no problem; firing it in a crowded theater; major problem. It's the same as yelling fire, if there is no clear and present danger in doing so, such as in a park.....it's harder to prove that the right has ended, but in a crowded building......you cause a stampede and you bet you're then liable criminally and potentially civilly for all damages caused. Probably though, my favorite two tests of the right are fighting words and incitement to riot, but hey, those will come up later if the attempted gun grabbers need more debate to realize they lost.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

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  6. #206
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    Re: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Well, possibly, although some might try to buy one, which is why I said:

    Bold blue emphasis added...
    So basically your idea does not stop criminals from owning firearms and it just gives the government a database which can be used against those who do legally own firearms.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  7. #207
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    Re: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    What, exactly, is the 2nd amendment equivelant to yelling fire in a a theater?
    What, exactly, is the 2nd amendment equivelant to slander? Libel?
    Your argument hinges on the notion is that there should be an equivalent restriction for every amendment Not every action has equivalent reactions. That is a fallacy.

    Walking around drunk in public will not carry the same equivalent punishment as driving drunk. Kidnapping a person will not have the same equivalent punishment as car jacking.

    Murdering somebody does not have an equivalent punishment in robbery. People who steal $100,000,000 will not get the same punishment as somebody who kills 10 people.

    Different issues. Different restrictions, laws, 'infringements'.

    Your argument is a fallacy. The 1st amendment and the 2nd amendment carry different restrictions and different laws around them.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  8. #208
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    Re: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights

    You know, we should go watch a movie together sometime. I might feel like yelling, "fire" and if you happen to die in a stampede...well, I was inside my 1st amendment rights
    That isn't an exercise of your 1st amendment rights. That is milicious mischief and rendering of a false alarm. Both of which are punishable by jail time.
    If somebody dies as a result, then it's a felony punishable by a life sentence (in most states).
    Oh, you mean like if say Glenn Beck or Rush Limbaugh say something like Obama is coming to get your guns, or that the government is stealing your money, or taking away your freedoms, and someone flies a plane into or blows up a federal building because of it? Yea, I get it.

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    Re: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights

    How would a firearm registration prevent a violent criminal from owning a firearm? Wouldn't a violent criminal get his gun from a private owner or through illegal means?
    This is the reason I believe we need to start getting some control over how many guns are out there flooding the market. I believe the safety of the people is pushed aside for the profits of the gun runners and they're using the constitution and scare tactics to push their product. If every gun sold was licensed to an owner, and some responsibility taken for owning a gun, it would eventually become more difficult for violent criminals, gang members, and burgulers to get their hands on one. If we would have started this years ago, we'd all be much safer now.

  10. #210
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    Re: What are reasonable restrictions/infringements on 1st and second amendment rights

    Quote Originally Posted by jacksbrat View Post
    This is the reason I believe we need to start getting some control over how many guns are out there flooding the market. I believe the safety of the people is pushed aside for the profits of the gun runners and they're using the constitution and scare tactics to push their product. If every gun sold was licensed to an owner, and some responsibility taken for owning a gun, it would eventually become more difficult for violent criminals, gang members, and burgulers to get their hands on one. If we would have started this years ago, we'd all be much safer now.
    So until that mythical time when guns are all gone we'll just have to put up with armed criminals killing law-abiding unarmed people at will, I guess.

    Brilliant idea.

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