View Poll Results: Should B&B owners be allowed to refuse gay couples?

Voters
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  • Yes, they should be allowed to refuse anyone for any reason

    65 59.63%
  • The should be allowed to refuse if it violates their religious beliefs

    3 2.75%
  • They should be fined for discriminating against gays

    16 14.68%
  • They should lose their B&B license for discriminating against gays

    19 17.43%
  • Other, please explain

    6 5.50%
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Thread: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous grounds

  1. #321
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by alexa View Post
    That is because not everyone on the board is from the US and the incident itself happened in the UK where there are such laws to stop people from acting out their prejudices.

    It works just fine apart from for the odd bigot who gets caught.
    do you think the passage of a law precludes further debate on an issue?



  2. #322
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you seem confused and determined to engage in sophistry

    if you are a libertarian you need to check out your philosophy

    it is my opinion that the federal government only has the PROPER powers delegated to it to the constitution

    I am at loss to find where the power to force a bed and breakfast to serve gays was delegated to the government

    it also is MY OPINION that the sanctity of the right to contract or to control your own personal property TRUMPS laws that impose the contrary on people

    let us see if your supposed logic is strong enough to refute that
    A lame comment seeing as my political ideology stems from realism and not idealism. Due to this fact, i view liberty and freedom in a more - dare we say - sophisticated manner than the general libertarian base.

    If anything; the bed and breakfast owners were acting in a "non competitive" manner (notice i did not say anti-competitive). You and the rest cannot (and have not) been able to rationalize any particular reason to behave "non competitively" other than "i can do what i want".

    In fact; i can think of a ton of reasons to be non competitive and not infringe on other peoples lives. Can you?
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  3. #323
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    do you think the passage of a law precludes further debate on an issue?
    No of course not but it makes no difference what the laws are in the US to us.

    If people want to change this sort of thing they generally vote for the BNP.
    George Monboit "Neoliberalism is inherently incompatible with democracy, as people will always rebel against the austerity and fiscal tyranny it prescribes. Something has to give, and it must be the people. This is the true road to serfdom: disinventing democracy on behalf of the elite."

  4. #324
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    A lame comment seeing as my political ideology stems from realism and not idealism. Due to this fact, i view liberty and freedom in a more - dare we say - sophisticated manner than the general libertarian base.

    If anything; the bed and breakfast owners were acting in a "non competitive" manner (notice i did not say anti-competitive). You and the rest cannot (and have not) been able to rationalize any particular reason to behave "non competitively" other than "i can do what i want".

    In fact; i can think of a ton of reasons to be non competitive and not infringe on other peoples lives. Can you?
    lets cut the crap and stop the nonsense

    the poll was SHOULD A B A B owner be allowed

    My answer was yes

    Not because it is a good business decision

    not becuase the law says yes or no

    Merely because it is my opinion that is the right of a property owner

    now you can engage in all t he mental self abuse you want but you are never going to prove my opinion is wrong or that what I value--personal property rights over even business sense--is WRONG

    you can disagree with it but stop pretending you can prove an opinion wrong

    I was Ed Clark's campaign chairman for New Haven many years ago so I understand the true libertarian philosophy. I am sure he wouldn't support such a law



  5. #325
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post

    Merely because it is my opinion that is the right of a property owner

    now you can engage in all t he mental self abuse you want but you are never going to prove my opinion is wrong or that what I value--personal property rights over even business sense--is WRONG

    you can disagree with it but stop pretending you can prove an opinion wrong
    No you put the right to be offensive and prejudiced above treating all members of society equally. That is all that this is about.

    Nothing to do with property rights or business, that is just to hide behind.
    George Monboit "Neoliberalism is inherently incompatible with democracy, as people will always rebel against the austerity and fiscal tyranny it prescribes. Something has to give, and it must be the people. This is the true road to serfdom: disinventing democracy on behalf of the elite."

  6. #326
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    lets cut the crap and stop the nonsense

    the poll was SHOULD A B A B owner be allowed

    My answer was yes

    Not because it is a good business decision

    not becuase the law says yes or no

    Merely because it is my opinion that is the right of a property owner

    now you can engage in all t he mental self abuse you want but you are never going to prove my opinion is wrong or that what I value--personal property rights over even business sense--is WRONG

    you can disagree with it but stop pretending you can prove an opinion wrong

    I was Ed Clark's campaign chairman for New Haven many years ago so I understand the true libertarian philosophy. I am sure he wouldn't support such a law
    I could care less about your opinion. Not allowing bigotry in business has little effect in the "rights" restriction argument. From a business position, such legislation has only a positive effect.

    In fact; on my "i give a ****" list, protecting ones right to operate a business in a bigoted manner is very far down towards the bottom. Not as far as protecting someones right to yell fire in a crowded building. Seeing as both are illegal, there are far more troubling legislative imbalances that need to be corrected.

    My opinion? I hoped they are fined. Wah Wah, you cant pwove my 'pinion wong. Happy to argue on your level
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  7. #327
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by MyOwnDrum View Post
    This is in England where a Christian B&B owner refused a homosexual couple accommodation. Should this be allowed or not? For those of you who haven't visited the UK, B&Bs are much more common over there and American style motels are rare. Many, many homeowners supplement their incomes by operating B&Bs in their homes.

    Should they be forced to take in gay couples if it is against their religious beliefs?

    Gay couple turned away from B&B by Christian owners | World news | The Guardian
    No the owner should be sued and lose their B&B license. If the owner has idiotic religious "beliefs" then he's free to re-evaluate them and admit that they're stupid and amoral. If he chooses to assert idiotic beliefs, then that's his fault, not the patron's. Glad that we brought this cult member out of the closet. Hope he gets ****ed over in court.

    Beliefs based on ignorance deserve no respect. Next we'll have to start granting flat-earth believers a "right" to their beliefs.
    Last edited by Toothpicvic; 04-03-10 at 05:30 PM.

  8. #328
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by alexa View Post
    No you put the right to be offensive and prejudiced above treating all members of society equally. That is all that this is about.

    Nothing to do with property rights or business, that is just to hide behind.
    more stupidity

    why do lefties think because I defend freedom I support all actions that one can exercise in the pursuit of freedom

    I support legalized prostitution but I would never engage the services of a prostitute

    I think coke and weed ought to be legal-yet I would be disgusted if my son or niece were to be coke addicts

    I support the freedom of a business owner to deny service to whom he wants to deny it to even if I would not


    You haven't heard of Voltaire have you?



  9. #329
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    more stupidity

    why do lefties think because I defend freedom I support all actions that one can exercise in the pursuit of freedom

    I support legalized prostitution but I would never engage the services of a prostitute

    I think coke and weed ought to be legal-yet I would be disgusted if my son or niece were to be coke addicts

    I support the freedom of a business owner to deny service to whom he wants to deny it to even if I would not


    You haven't heard of Voltaire have you?
    Actually I agree with you. The owner is an idiot, but (as personal a subject as this is to me) I agree that there's no real reason to prosecute her over this.

  10. #330
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Toothpicvic View Post
    Actually I agree with you. The owner is an idiot, but (as personal a subject as this is to me) I agree that there's no real reason to prosecute her over this.
    yep but i won't judge the man

    if he is losing business by not serving gays then he is a poor businessman

    If he is gaining business then he is a good business man

    If he is willing to lose business based on his personal beliefs that doesnt make him an idiot but a man of conviction.



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