View Poll Results: Should B&B owners be allowed to refuse gay couples?

Voters
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  • Yes, they should be allowed to refuse anyone for any reason

    65 59.63%
  • The should be allowed to refuse if it violates their religious beliefs

    3 2.75%
  • They should be fined for discriminating against gays

    16 14.68%
  • They should lose their B&B license for discriminating against gays

    19 17.43%
  • Other, please explain

    6 5.50%
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Thread: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous grounds

  1. #211
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
    I have a constitutional right to be naked too, but not in a store.
    Well there's no constitutional right to that, but going from there you certainly can't do so in a store because you're on someone's property.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  2. #212
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Well there's no constitutional right to that, but going from there you certainly can't do so in a store because you're on someone's property.
    Sure there is. You have a right to be naked, just not anywhere you please. (there may not be an amendment saying "the right to be naked" but any law that would allow you to be arrested in your home for being so -- or in a nudist colony -- would be unconstitutional, right?

    I'll use a better example.

    You have a constitutional right to practice your religion. You do NOT have a right to do it anywhere you damn well please. You cannot come into my store and start singing a hymn or passing out Bibles or trying to convert my customers.

    I can set standards for my store so long as they are not discriminatory.

  3. #213
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
    Sure there is. You have a right to be naked, just not anywhere you please. (there may not be an amendment saying "the right to be naked" but any law that would allow you to be arrested in your home for being so -- or in a nudist colony -- would be unconstitutional, right?

    I'll use a better example.

    You have a constitutional right to practice your religion. You do NOT have a right to do it anywhere you damn well please. You cannot come into my store and start singing a hymn or passing out Bibles or trying to convert my customers.

    I can set standards for my store so long as they are not discriminatory.
    Well by "constitutional right" that would mean one of the rights outlined in the Constitution. Which being naked is not one of them. Regardless, I don't care if your standards are discriminatory; your store your rules. If you don't want Christians in your store, then you should be free to kick their zombie worshiping butts out of your store.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  4. #214
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Well by "constitutional right" that would mean one of the rights outlined in the Constitution. Which being naked is not one of them. Regardless, I don't care if your standards are discriminatory; your store your rules. If you don't want Christians in your store, then you should be free to kick their zombie worshiping butts out of your store.
    Well, fortunately, your views are not the law of the land.

    I am glad we no longer have stores with signs saying "No Irish" or businesses that refuse to serve blacks or Jews or whatever. And much of that would have never happened without laws.

  5. #215
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
    Well, fortunately, your views are not the law of the land.

    I am glad we no longer have stores with signs saying "No Irish" or businesses that refuse to serve blacks or Jews or whatever. And much of that would have never happened without laws.
    Why? You think that couldn't be brought about through proper consumer pressure? Or is it that you just don't want to do the work to create your Equalia, so you'll use government force on people to make it so?
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  6. #216
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    I totally understand. Denying access to a consumer based on them practicing a constitutional right...OK...based on sexual choice? not OK!!!
    Why are y'all talking about constitutional rights? This thread is about something happening in the UK - no written constitution exists. You can't take anyone to court for violating constitutional rights, just for breaking the law. The law is clear. The owners broke it. They can campaign to change the law but they must face the consequences of breaking it until it's changed. You can't conduct this debate by resorting to constitutional rights.
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  7. #217
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Why? You think that couldn't be brought about through proper consumer pressure? Or is it that you just don't want to do the work to create your Equalia, so you'll use government force on people to make it so?
    Damn right it wouldn't have happened without pressure, campaigning, civil disobedience and law change. If it could have done, it would have done. It didn't without intervention. Even Adam Smith didn't claim the invisible hand would deliver justice.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

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  8. #218
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Why? You think that couldn't be brought about through proper consumer pressure?
    Yes, that's right, based on history. The majority often oppresses the rights of the minority. Wishing that black people would be treated fairly only took 100 years after the Civil War -- until laws were written (and more importantly, enforced).

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Or is it that you just don't want to do the work to create your Equalia, so you'll use government force on people to make it so?
    Strange how people who bitch about "government control" have no problem with control from everyone else. Personally, I think it's a good idea to have laws to prevent the powerful from destroying the very ideals this country is based on.

  9. #219
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
    Yes, that's right, based on history. The majority often oppresses the rights of the minority. Wishing that black people would be treated fairly only took 100 years after the Civil War -- until laws were written (and more importantly, enforced).
    A lot of that was legal context within the government, some of which is proper. But then to extend it to private property goes a bit too far.

    Quote Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
    Strange how people who bitch about "government control" have no problem with control from everyone else. Personally, I think it's a good idea to have laws to prevent the powerful from destroying the very ideals this country is based on.
    HAHAHAHAHA, the powerful have already destroyed many of the very ideals this country was based on.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  10. #220
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    Re: Should a Bed and Breakfast Owner be allowed to refuse Gay couples on religous gro

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    HAHAHAHAHA, the powerful have already destroyed many of the very ideals this country was based on.
    Um, yes, that's my point.

    You libertarians seem to have some misguided view that if we just leave the powerful alone then they will be nice to us and no bad will ever happen.

    I think that a society should do something to prevent that from happening.

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