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Which is the racist position?

Which is the racist position?


  • Total voters
    30
I am NOT going to admit to something I do not agree with. So, no. I stand by my position. Context is what matters.

So, you actually think that a white comedian could tell that joke at a comedy club, and because of the context it would be okay? He wouldn't be crucified in the media? His career wouldn't be over?

But contrariwise, we've had black comedians saying as bad or worse about, oh I dunno.... Dubya Bush... for years and years, and people just laugh if anyone is offended?


You know damn well there's a double standard, Cap.
 
Would you tell the joke to a random black person(someone you do not know)?

Hey did you hear that Halmark is making a Barack Obama Christmas ornament? Now everyone can hang a nigger from a tree.

No, because the context would be inappropriate.
 
1069 is a little screwed up in the head.

/End thread
 
So, you actually think that a white comedian could tell that joke at a comedy club, and because of the context it would be okay? He wouldn't be crucified in the media? His career wouldn't be over?

But contrariwise, we've had black comedians saying as bad or worse about, oh I dunno.... Dubya Bush... for years and years, and people just laugh if anyone is offended?


You know damn well there's a double standard, Cap.

I am uninterested in what OTHERS think, when discussing what I think. To me, context is what matters. If someone takes offense at a white comedian telling a joke about blacks, then, for me, they are not getting the context, and my opinion of them would be that they are playing the victim.

I also think that most folks who understand context would feel similarly to me, though their millage may vary to some extent.
 
I am uninterested in what OTHERS think, when discussing what I think. To me, context is what matters. If someone takes offense at a white comedian telling a joke about blacks, then, for me, they are not getting the context, and my opinion of them would be that they are playing the victim.

I also think that most folks who understand context would feel similarly to me, though their millage may vary to some extent.


We weren't talking about your personal standards, we were talking about societal standards, obviously.

Society has a double standard regarding humor aimed at blacks by whites...

...vs humor aimed at whites by blacks.

Context isn't the primary issue in society, which race is the butt of the joke is.

Do you disagree with this statement?
 
We weren't talking about your personal standards, we were talking about societal standards, obviously.

Society has a double standard regarding humor aimed at blacks by whites...

...vs humor aimed at whites by blacks.

Context isn't the primary issue in society, which race is the butt of the joke is.

Do you disagree with this statement?

In the specific scenario that you just presented above, I think it would depend on two factors. To a lesser extent, context, to a greater extent the person hearing the comment.
 
Context is ALWAYS important.

That still does not say why you wouldn't tell some random black on the street that joke. Why would you not tell the joke to some random black guy on the street?
 
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In the specific scenario that you just presented above, I think it would depend on two factors. To a lesser extent, context, to a greater extent the person hearing the comment.


Yes, the person hearing the comment...

That joke would go over well at a KKK meeting, I expect.

In a more random gathering of all-white people, some would laugh, some would chuckle nervously, some would be royally pissed and the joke-teller would not be invited to the next block-party. :mrgreen:


If told in a comedy club with cameras rolling and a random crowd, it would be front-page news tomorrow. If the joke-teller was a comedian of any great standing, he would be ripped by every commentator on TV for the next two weeks. Rehab would be suggested. Sensitivity camp would be demanded. His career would be over. The President himself would probably comment to the press. Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton would have a field day.

Yet Spike Lee can say that Charleton Heston needs to be shot with a .44, and that's perfectly fine.
 
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Being offended does not make you a victim.

That's probably true in a literal sense, but it may be that being easily offended denotes a victim mentality, in which case you are a victim in your own mind, which is the worst place victim status can occur.
 
That still does not say why you wouldn't tell some random black on the street that joke.

Because the context of the situation is different than if I were to tell a black friend, for example, the same thing.
 
That still does not say why you wouldn't tell some random black on the street that joke.
How so?

In the context of you walking up to some random black person on some random street and telling them a racist joke...

It would be a bad idea.

And also a racist-ish move.

In bad taste.

A faux paux, perhaps, depending on your own tendencies towards racism.

Full blown racism, depending on your own tendencies towards racism and your intention in telling it (to be racist, or to tell a joke).

And probably some other things.

Edit:
Because the context of the situation is different than if I were to tell a black friend, for example, the same thing.
And this.

Much more concise, I must say.
 
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Because the context of the situation is different than if I were to tell a black friend, for example, the same thing.

Why wouldn't you tell the joke to some random black guy on the street?
 
Why wouldn't you tell the joke to some random black guy on the street?
Because, depending on the street, you don't have a death wish. :mrgreen:
 
How so?

In the context of you walking up to some random black person on some random street and telling them a racist joke...

It would be a bad idea.

And also a racist-ish move.

In bad taste.

A faux paux, perhaps, depending on your own tendencies towards racism.

Full blown racism, depending on your own tendencies towards racism and your intention in telling it (to be racist, or to tell a joke).

And probably some other things.

Edit:And this.

Much more concise, I must say.


According to Captain Courtesy context is all that matter not whether or not the joke is actually racist. So he should have no problem telling the joke to some random black guy on the street.He doesn't want to admit that there is a double standard when it comes to racism,especially jokes. W white guy telling racist jokes about black people is no different than a black guy telling racist jokes about white people. The only difference is that one would get metaphorically lynched by the media while the other gets a free pass.
 
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Yes, the person hearing the comment...

That joke would go over well at a KKK meeting, I expect.

Agree. Context and the receiver.

In a more random gathering of all-white people, some would laugh, some would chuckle nervously, some would be royally pissed and the joke-teller would not be invited to the next block-party. :mrgreen:

Agree. Context and the receiver, though whether he got invited to the next block party, would depend on who is throwing it. ;)


If told in a comedy club with cameras rolling and a random crowd, it would be front-page news tomorrow. If the joke-teller was a comedian of any great standing, he would be ripped by every commentator on TV for the next two weeks. The President himself would probably comment to the press. Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton would have a field day.

You are talking about a couple of things, here, though. Why would the press make a big deal out of it? Context... the context to sell papers/advertising by presenting a "race" issue... something that nearly always gets people to "look". I'm not 100% sure that the President would say anything, so I'm not going to comment on that. Jackson and Sharpton? Their context is to create race out of ANYTHING. I suspect their purpose for doing that is more self serving than anything else. Folks at the club? It would depend on the person.

Yet Spike Lee can say that Charleton Heston needs to be shot with a .44, and that's perfectly fine.

You seem upset that he did this. Notice the context? ;)
 
According to Captain Courtesy context is all that matter not whether or not the joke is actually racist. So he should have no problem telling the joke to some random black guy on the street.
In this case, racism is PART of the context.

If you don't know the random black person on the street, you can't possibly know if he/she will respond negatively to such a comment.

Given the context of you walking up to a random black person and telling them a racist joke, which do you consider more likely:
  • That they think you are racist.
  • That they think you are telling a joke.
I would think option A the majority of the time.

If I, as a white person, were a bystander viewing this incident, I would think you were a racist too.

And, depending on the street and the person, you might die or get badly hurt in doing so.

Edit:
He doesn't want to admit that there is a double standard when it comes to racism,especially jokes. W white guy telling racist jokes about black people is no different than a black guy telling racist jokes about white people. The only difference is that one would get metaphorically lynched by the media while the other gets a free pass.
I did not get that at all from his post

And when did we start talking about the media here?

I thought we were talking about you walking up to some random black person on some random street and telling them a racist joke.

Stop projecting.
 
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According to Captain Courtesy context is all that matter not whether or not the joke is actually racist. So he should have no problem telling the joke to some random black guy on the street.

james, please don't post dishonestly by misrepresenting what I said. Makes you look silly.
 
Agree. Context and the receiver.



Agree. Context and the receiver, though whether he got invited to the next block party, would depend on who is throwing it. ;)




You are talking about a couple of things, here, though. Why would the press make a big deal out of it? Context... the context to sell papers/advertising by presenting a "race" issue... something that nearly always gets people to "look". I'm not 100% sure that the President would say anything, so I'm not going to comment on that. Jackson and Sharpton? Their context is to create race out of ANYTHING. I suspect their purpose for doing that is more self serving than anything else. Folks at the club? It would depend on the person.



You seem upset that he did this. Notice the context? ;)


Cap, Spike Lee's career wasn't destroyed because of that comment.

OTOH, that comedian that used to play on Seinfeld, whose name escapes me, remember his racial rip at a comedy club? Stick a fork in him, he's done.

The double standard does exist.
 
Cap, Spike Lee's career wasn't destroyed because of that comment.

OTOH, that comedian that used to play on Seinfeld, whose name escapes me, remember his racial rip at a comedy club? Stick a fork in him, he's done.

The double standard does exist.
Details are needed to determine context.

If memory servers (and it probably doesn't), that comedian you speak of showed his racist side.

Not in a comedic way, but in a racist way.

Thus the response.

But, I entirely agree, as to racist remarks, some people are more likely than others to be vilified by the various media outlets.
 
Cap, Spike Lee's career wasn't destroyed because of that comment.

OTOH, that comedian that used to play on Seinfeld, whose name escapes me, remember his racial rip at a comedy club? Stick a fork in him, he's done.

The double standard does exist.

I'm not saying the double standard doesn't exist. It certainly does. I'm looking at this from a very different standpoint though. I am looking at it both from my personal position and from the victimhood issue, which seems to be what the OP is getting at, based on his poll and first post. Whether a comment victimizes the group that it is aimed at depends on context, NOT on the comment alone.
 
In this case, racism is PART of the context.

If you don't know the random black person on the street, you can't possibly know if he/she will respond negatively to such a comment.

Given the context of you walking up to a random black person and telling them a racist joke, which do you consider more likely:
  • That they think you are racist.
  • That they think you are telling a joke.
I would think option A the majority of the time.

If I, as a white person, were a bystander viewing this incident, I would think you were a racist too..


Now what if it was a black guy telling a racist joke against white people to a random white person? Would other people around him think he is a racist or would they simply dismiss it.

And, depending on the street and the person, you might die or get badly hurt in doing so.

I am well aware that some people have the intelligence and mentality of a 4 year old and feel that that they have to resort to violence over what someone said.


I did not get that at all from his post

And when did we start talking about the media here?

I thought we were talking about you walking up to some random black person on some random street and telling them a racist joke.

Stop projecting

Again Captain Courtesy thinks only context is important, so then it should not matter who is telling the joke and who the joke is being told to.Society doesn't see it that and that is why one would get a free pass and another would be metaphorically lynched by the media.
 
Again Captain Courtesy thinks only context is important, so then it should not matter who is telling the joke and who the joke is being told to.Society doesn't see it that and that is why one would get a free pass and another would be metaphorically lynched by the media.

I am going to ask you AGAIN to cease misrepresenting and lying about my position. This is NOT what I am saying.
 
Now what if it was a black guy telling a racist joke against white people to a random white person? Would other people around him think he is a racist or would they simply dismiss it.
It would depend on the context of whom he was around, and who he was telling the joke to.
I would most likely consider it racist.

I am well aware that some people have the intelligence and mentality of a 4 year old and feel that that they have to resort to violence over what someone said.
Sad, isn't it?

Again Captain Courtesy thinks only context is important, so then it should not matter who is telling the joke and who the joke is being told to. Society doesn't see it that and that is why one would get a free pass and another would be metaphorically lynched by the media.
Did you seriously just imply that who tells a joke and who the joke is told to are not part of the context?!?!

If you were a white comedian telling a joke racist against black persons to a group of black and white persons while doing a show, most likely only those persons with racist tendencies or really thin skins would be offended.

If you were a white (are there any black ones??) Neo-Nazi telling a joke racist against black persons to a group of white Neo-Nazis, very likely none of them would be offended. And those who were wouldn't say anything, most likely.
 
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