Is killing a human always a bad thing?

Korimyr the Rat said:

Plenty of innocents in war zones. Or is it different somehow when they're killed by ordinance rather than small arms?

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I guess there are exceptions to every rule.Casualties are sometimes necessary(after all you do not want to endanger your own troops) but it does not change the fact it is still a bad thing to kill innocent civilians. Wars are not fought in open fields nor are weapons and munitions factories in open fields away from civilians.Civilian casualties should always be avoided as long as it does not increase the harm to your own troops.

Korimyr the Rat said:

Plenty of innocents in war zones. Or is it different somehow when they're killed by ordinance rather than small arms?

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No one seemed to mind all those 1600lb demolition bombs falling on German schools and neighborhoods.

I'm tempted to throw out a one-liner like "Some people need killing" (true enough), and call it a day, but I suppose some more serious substance is called for.

I do not believe killing is always a bad thing. The death of Saddam Hussein, for instance, provided "closure" for tens of thousands of families that had lost loved ones to his harsh and tyrannical rule, and forever ended the possibility that someone would try to free him and restore him to power. Good thing.

If I see some chap shooting up a kindergarden playground, and I pull my pistol and shoot him dead, I find it hard to see that as anything other than good.

I've never had to kill someone. I have, as a former LEO, been in several situations where I believed I was about to have to kill someone.... fortunately in all those cases they backed down before I pulled the trigger. I didn't have a problem with the idea of killing these persons, all of whom were threats to someone else. I don't think it would have bothered me very much, though I am okay with them deciding to surrender... I have no particular desire to kill if it isn't actually necessary.

I think killing is a serious matter, and something that should only be done for the most serious of reasons; after all other efforts fail, or if things happen too fast to allow any chance for other efforts to be made.

War is a slightly different situation. It is a soldiers' duty to carry out his lawful orders, and to kill when the situation calls for it. This is not murder, it is war.

I am generally opposed to abortion, and support capital punishment. I do not see it as a contradiction: I am for the preservation of innocent life, and favor appropriate punishments for the guilty. Anyone who can't understand that distinction is being intentionally dense.

Goobieman said:

No one seemed to mind all those 1600lb demolition bombs falling on German schools and neighborhoods.

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Noone but the Germans. Seem to recall we did a number on the Japanese, too.

It's war. I won't pretend to understand it on a personal level, but I've got a pretty good understanding of "us versus them" and I've always appreciated my good fortune to be on the side that gets to write the history books.

Ikari said:

Fetus is a human. You're doing the same thing Blackdog does with war. You're trying to dehumanize your victim so that you don't feel bad about killing. But you should understand your actions and consequences and accept them in full. If you're woman enough to make a choice, you should be woman enough to abide by the consequences. Abortion decreases human life by 1, that's the facts.

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your trying to attach human reality to something that is not. you can delude yourself into believing what you want. the way you talk cancer because it is alive is human. you try and attack human to cells. stop and think that it is you that has it backwards and are trying to pass it off on everyone else. abortion aborts a fetus. war kills or better still murders a human that is experiencing life. you would rather kill the human feeling person than a clump of cells. that is really a sickness. you'd protect cells and like an animal kill that which has a life.

Goobieman said:

The fact that it can be a 'good thing' negates the argument that it is 'always a bad thing'.

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I know, but people usually get carried away from the subject of the poll by getting confused by their own definitions, so I've tried to limit that to one definition.

Killing a human is always an unfortunate thing. However, it's not always evil and can be good. Say you see a serial killer about to shoot a child in the head and you have a gun. Is it wrong to end the life of the serial killer who is about to murder a child? What about in cases of self defense? Killing can be justified and not all killing is wrong or bad, but in all cases I believe death is an unfortunate thing, hence I voted "other."

katiegrrl0 said:

your trying to attach human reality to something that is not. you can delude yourself into believing what you want. the way you talk cancer because it is alive is human. you try and attack human to cells. stop and think that it is you that has it backwards and are trying to pass it off on everyone else. abortion aborts a fetus. war kills or better still murders a human that is experiencing life. you would rather kill the human feeling person than a clump of cells. that is really a sickness. you'd protect cells and like an animal kill that which has a life.

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If you don't know the difference between cancer cells and a fetus then you need to go back and take some high school biology. This isn't interpretation for you to remove consequence from action, it's simply biology.

Laila said:

Who?

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It's a dork thing. The Raven Queen is one of the neutral gods from Dungeons and Dragons. She's the goddess of death. Essentially it is viewed that there is no real good and evil, the only truth is death. There should be no pity for those who suffer and die for death is the natural end of life.

I had a warlock who was a pretty devout worshiper of the Raven Queen.

No, it isn't. Situations are relative.

jamesrage said:

No its not. The only time killing is a bad thing is when the person being killed is a innocent person.

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That's a very functional view. Basically it incorporates into it justification for the killing as well. While killing can be legally justified, it always results in the death of a human. And that act is never a good act. You may feel it necessary, but it's still not a good thing to kill someone. Ending the life of a fellow human is not a good act.

Ikari said:

If you don't know the difference between cancer cells and a fetus then you need to go back and take some high school biology. This isn't interpretation for you to remove consequence from action, it's simply biology.

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there is a difference between life and having a life. you would rather protect something that is living cells. you would send something that has a life off to die. that is bizarre and wrong headed. let that which already has a life be killed save that which is live cells be saved. that is really twisted. do you pat yourself on the back over protecting the cells or do you pat yourself on the back for getting killed that which has a life. either way it must get tiring standing on a pro life pedestal surrounded by the killing you support. go figure.

katiegrrl0 said:

there is a difference between life and having a life. you would rather protect something that is living cells. you would send something that has a life off to die. that is bizarre and wrong headed. let that which already has a life be killed save that which is live cells be saved. that is really twisted. do you pat yourself on the back over protecting the cells or do you pat yourself on the back for getting killed that which has a life. either way it must get tiring standing on a pro life pedestal surrounded by the killing you support. go figure.

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The hyperbole is getting a bit out of hand here. Maybe some deep breaths and the go find where I said I'd allow people to die. Just go ahead and find that part. Or admit that you've exaggerated a bit much based solely on my position.

Ikari said:

That's a very functional view. Basically it incorporates into it justification for the killing as well. While killing can be legally justified, it always results in the death of a human. And that act is never a good act. You may feel it necessary, but it's still not a good thing to kill someone. Ending the life of a fellow human is not a good act.

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According to most here it can be a good act.
According to my God it can be.
According to most laws, it can be.
According to most people it can be.


Ending the life of a human who is evil is a good act. Killing a human can be a good act. Killing someone who is suffering and terminal can be a good act.

That is unless you subscribe to your personal morality and most do not.

Blackdog said:

According to most here it can be a good act.
According to my God it can be.
According to most laws, it can be.
According to most people it can be.


Ending the life of a human who is evil is a good act. Killing a human can be a good act. Killing someone who is suffering and terminal can be a good act.

That is unless you subscribe to your personal morality and most do not.

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Opinion polls do not make reality. There is a simple test and that is to consider the base nature of humans and whether or not you think fundamental, on an individual level, all humans share similarities.

As for your god, well that god can be just as wrong as the hundreds of gods which came before it. Gods are hardly convincing argument. Philosophy and study of nature carry much more weight IMO.

Ikari said:

Opinion polls do not make reality.

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I agree, but it does add weight to my argument yours does not have.

Ikari said:

There is a simple test and that is to consider the base nature of humans and whether or not you think fundamental, on an individual level, all humans share similarities.

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Of course we do on some base level. This does not translate into morality. Morality is subjective from person to person so absolutes do not exist.

The question was "is the killing of a human always bad thing." The consensus in law and even on a moral level is no.

Ikari said:

As for your god, well that god can be just as wrong as the hundreds of gods which came before it. Gods are hardly convincing argument. Philosophy and study of nature carry much more weight IMO.

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In your opinion, yes. Contrary to what you may believe, I enjoy reading your opinions. I also have great respect for the fact you stick by your principles. I wish more people would.

In the end though, it contains no more validity than anyone else's opinion. Being my opinion is also backed up by hundreds of years of law, I think I have the advantage this time.

Hell No! Mess with me and/or my family? I will kill you dead and will walk. As it should be.

Some people just need killin.

Folks are NOT talking about rights here. They are talking about instincts, desires, morals and behaviors. Unless someone can define rights in a way that I am not seeing, there are NO rights that exist, naturally. If you believe that killing a human is bad, that is your MORALS. A human has no RIGHT to live. They have a desire and an instinct. That's about it.

Always a bad thing? No. In some cases, an evil needs to be removed.

Nip it. Nip it in the bud.

Even if it's completely justifiable, I cannot imagine killing being a good thing. If you shoot someone in the head who was trying to mug you, are you going to be totally excited about it? Probably not. You'll more than likely be in shock. I guess my opinion on the matter is that killing is certainly the last thing one should resort to.

EgoffTib said:

Even if it's completely justifiable, I cannot imagine killing being a good thing.

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From the OP:

Apocalypse said:

Just to clarify, the question is not if killing a human can be a good thing, but if it is always a bad thing.

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You do not have to regard to it as a good thing in order for it to be considered as not bad.
Not bad does not necessarily mean good, there is a middle value.

EgoffTib said:

Even if it's completely justifiable, I cannot imagine killing being a good thing. If you shoot someone in the head who was trying to mug you, are you going to be totally excited about it? Probably not. You'll more than likely be in shock. I guess my opinion on the matter is that killing is certainly the last thing one should resort to.

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"A regrettable necessity, whose goodness/utility is seen only when compared to the alternative."

Ikari said:

That's a very functional view. Basically it incorporates into it justification for the killing as well. While killing can be legally justified, it always results in the death of a human.

] And that act is never a good act.

You may feel it necessary, but it's still not a good thing to kill someone. Ending the life of a fellow human is not a good act.

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It is if that act permanently stops a murderer,punishes those who deserve death,stops a crime from happening or permanently stops some other evil person then killing is a good and moral act.