View Poll Results: Where did the Universe come from?

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  • From the Big Bang, not sure what was before. God does not exist and was not involved.

    39 38.24%
  • Not the Big Bang, but some other physical event. God does not exist and was not involved.

    2 1.96%
  • God created the Universe without a Big Bang. Earth was especially created.

    2 1.96%
  • God created the Universe with a Big Bang and then the universe evolved.

    37 36.27%
  • Some other mechanism created the Universe, without God...

    13 12.75%
  • God created the Universe in some other fashion...

    9 8.82%
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Thread: Where did the Universe come from?

  1. #301
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
    What is the difference between a substance...you mean like global warming ...we have no way of verifying that exists....yet alot of supposedly intelligent individuals believe it
    Ummm....a thermometer. Seriously, that's what it takes to measure global warming. You take a long serious of continuous temperature data and you look at the trends compared to previous data. That's how you verify global warming. I think you meant to say "causes of global warming", not global warming itself. Since no one is foolish enough to claim that thermometers don't exist.
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  2. #302
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    God is not something. God is not nothing. God is spirit and underlies the entire universe. Everything in the universe is a part of God. God is in everything. God is found in the smallest and in the largest.

    It is a matter of belief. There is no evidence for it.
    and that's your opinion.

    However, if one can come to that conclusion about some mythical being, then it only stands to reason that the conclusion that the universe and the energy within it has just always *been*, isn't far fetched.

  3. #303
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    and that's your opinion.
    Yes.

    However, if one can come to that conclusion about some mythical being, then it only stands to reason that the conclusion that the universe and the energy within it has just always *been*, isn't far fetched.
    I believe all evidence points to an inflationary universe, which implies a beginning. Anything with a beginning has an end.

  4. #304
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
    A spirit is an entity without physical mass.
    you have described what "spirit" is NOT. I want to know what "spirit" IS and how you know it to be so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
    There is no way to "PROVE" that a spirit exists...as well as there is no way for science to "PROVE" anything about how our universe was created...or first life
    1) Science doesn't PROVE anything. PROOFS are only valid in math. Science only supports theories with evidence and verfiable predictions.. What evidence is there to SUPPORT the existence of "spirit"? What testable predictions can be madeto support the existence of "spirit"?

    2) Science has yet to present a supported theory on how life began or what "caused" the big bang (I quoted "caused" because it may be nonsensical to discuss causation or "before" the big bang). The big bang has lots of evidence: formation and movement of known universe, background radiation, among other things.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
    What is the difference between a substance...you mean like global warming ...we have no way of verifying that exists....yet alot of supposedly intelligent individuals believe it
    There is EVIDENCE and VERIFIABLE PREDICTIONS about global warming? What evidence or predictions do you have for "spirit"?
    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

    Questioning or criticizing another's core beliefs is inadvertently perceived as offensive and rude.

  5. #305
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    I believe all evidence points to an inflationary universe, which implies a beginning.
    it implies a beginning to the inflation. It does not imply that before the beginning of the inflation there was nothing. We just don't know.

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    Anything with a beginning has an end.
    False. Please explain why if something has a beginning it MUST have an end?

    Furthermore, none of which you have said necessitates a God let alone a personal God.
    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

    Questioning or criticizing another's core beliefs is inadvertently perceived as offensive and rude.

  6. #306
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib
    God is not something. God is not nothing. God is spirit and underlies the entire universe. Everything in the universe is a part of God. God is in everything. God is found in the smallest and in the largest.

    It is a matter of belief. There is no evidence for it.
    If god is "everything" then god is the universe, which goes against nearly all religious teachings about what god is and its capacity as a being.

    Moreover, something cannot be neither "something" nor "nothing". You make that silly statement then you go on to say "god is..." So you contradict yourself by both saying "god is not something" and "god is spirit" that "is in everything" and can be "found in the smallest and the largest". Saying these things implies that god is "something" and "somewhere" and therefore you're contradicting yourself.

    You can believe that god is both something and not something and not nothing, but you might as well also believe that a is both equal to a and not equal to a. In other words, when you do that you are throwing out all form of reason or rational thought and we can't take you seriously.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

  7. #307
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    False. Please explain why if something has a beginning it MUST have an end?
    2nd Law of Thermodynamics. All you need to do is produce one counter-example to prove your assertion that something can have a beginning with no end.

    Furthermore, none of which you have said necessitates a God let alone a personal God.
    True. Mind you I have said nothing about a personal God. Nothing you have said disproves or demonstrates the absence of God.

  8. #308
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    But M Theory (11 dimensional space-time, 7 dimensions closed) and Multiverses don't exclude or preclude the existence of God, either. There is room for both. One is spiritual and the others are astrophysical.
    Nor do they preclude that all that is was spawned by a giant cabbage.

  9. #309
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    2nd Law of Thermodynamics.
    please state the 2nd law of thermo dynamics and how it necessitates that all things that have formed must have an end. Simply asserting that the 2nd law of thermo dynamics supports your claim is both lazy and asinine.
    Note: the 2nd law of thermo dynamics applies to CLOSED systems only.

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    All you need to do is produce one counter-example to prove your assertion that something can have a beginning with no end.
    the burden of proof is not on me to disprove your claims. It is on YOU to support them. What evidence do you have that ALL things end? We have lots of evidence that lots of things change FORMS. E.g.n water to ice, organic material rots, paper burns. But we have zero evidence of the energy and matter ENDING, ceasing to exist.


    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    True. Mind you I have said nothing about a personal God. Nothing you have said disproves or demonstrates the absence of God.
    Likewise nothing I have said disproves trasndimensional pixies, or leprachauns, or santa claus.
    You seem to be of the mindset that you believe something until it been disproven. This is a demonstrably flawed method of reasoning.
    You should believe things when evidence and reason support them. Not merely because one can't disprove something. Otherwise we'd be forced to believe in all sorts of absurd and fantastical things.
    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

    Questioning or criticizing another's core beliefs is inadvertently perceived as offensive and rude.

  10. #310
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    please state the 2nd law of thermo dynamics and how it necessitates that all things that have formed must have an end. Simply asserting that the 2nd law of thermo dynamics supports your claim is both lazy and asinine.
    Note: the 2nd law of thermo dynamics applies to CLOSED systems only.
    The universe is a closed system.

    the burden of proof is not on me to disprove your claims. It is on YOU to support them. What evidence do you have that ALL things end? We have lots of evidence that lots of things change FORMS. E.g.n water to ice, organic material rots, paper burns. But we have zero evidence of the energy and matter ENDING, ceasing to exist.
    You are the one claiming the universe does not end. Prove it.



    Likewise nothing I have said disproves trasndimensional pixies, or leprachauns, or santa claus.
    You seem to be of the mindset that you believe something until it been disproven. This is a demonstrably flawed method of reasoning.
    You should believe things when evidence and reason support them. Not merely because one can't disprove something. Otherwise we'd be forced to believe in all sorts of absurd and fantastical things.
    There is no evidence of God. Reason supports the existence of God, once you have started with the premise that God exists. It is a matter of faith and not reasoning.

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