View Poll Results: Where did the Universe come from?

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  • From the Big Bang, not sure what was before. God does not exist and was not involved.

    39 38.24%
  • Not the Big Bang, but some other physical event. God does not exist and was not involved.

    2 1.96%
  • God created the Universe without a Big Bang. Earth was especially created.

    2 1.96%
  • God created the Universe with a Big Bang and then the universe evolved.

    37 36.27%
  • Some other mechanism created the Universe, without God...

    13 12.75%
  • God created the Universe in some other fashion...

    9 8.82%
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Thread: Where did the Universe come from?

  1. #261
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    No option for other?

    I don't think the universe was ever created.
    Sure, it is just your dream. You are dreaming of me too. Actually I am not even typing, I am only in your personal imagination.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheGirlNextDoor View Post
    I think the same. Couldn't it just have always "been"? Why must it have been 'created'?

    None of the poll choices even closely match what I believe, so I am voting "other''.
    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    No option for other?.
    The answer is – the OP was written by a very intelligent man. reefedjib provided me with joy to seeing a man who has abilities to think and think independently and quite brilliantly. My original intent was to compliment him, but I was too tired and couldn’t get to those few posts which gave the joy of observing human intelligence.

    Obviously he did expect a conversation on intelligent level somewhat close to his level. I just wanted to tell him that he should get used to the fact that it will not happen any time when he wants to mention God. One indeed has to have a hell of patience talking to atheists, when atheists do not understand a simple thought, phrase, and sentence. So, he shouldn’t start swearing and coursing.I know it takes a hell of patience, but I for instance remind to myself that I also used to be an atheist when my mind and intellect was not developed.

    Obviously he did not think about including option which could come to minds of people with undeveloped intellect and infant comprehension of reality. He covered all even slightly reasonable options.
    .
    Quote Originally Posted by TheGirlNextDoor View Post
    I think the same. Couldn't it just have always "been"?
    This exactly what my dog thinks and comprehends about reality around him.
    Why did the author of OP have to count in this level of comprehension of reality?


    Let me ask you a simple question. If you think that the universe… I wouldn’t even ask you to explain how one can think so… let’s say it always has been, - then who made it start heading to the end, to death, non-existence all over suddenly?

  2. #262
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Don't feel like reading 26 pages....


    I would say that you have missed some of most brilliant an deep thoughts expressed on DP, I should take time and find them again, but the fact is that atheists did not comprehend them anyway and made reefedjib loose his patience. I just wanted to comment that he shouldn’t expect atheists to comprehend most simple sentences, to answer most simple questions. I wanted to tell him that I enjoyed, appreciated and learned . He should learn not to let atheists to bring him back to clichés and standard thinking. It does not matter, he or she or it at the moment, there is no need to get involved into sidetracks. He should learn that scourge only wants to exhaust one’s patience. Also when he goes into non-Christian BS – energy, matter etc, he looses brilliance and follows BS, I just wanted to remind him that his Hindu beliefs contradict physics, go against physics, in all of all who did make physics- Christians or Hindu? He actually showed a natural thinking of a physicist, of Newton and Einstein type. I enjoyed and learned. Then he lost to Hindu…

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    So, I go with the previously mentioned "Option 7".

    I don't know.

    As that is what I believe, I cannot say which of the other 6 possible answers is closer to what I believe.

    In short, I believe that I do not know where the Universe came from. Or, for that matter, if it even exists at all.

    Edit: Or anything, really.
    Anyway, I like when atheists think that they need to show up on a debate and make this intellectual statement – ‘’I don’t care’’. What a misery.

  3. #263
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by justone View Post
    I would say that you have missed some of most brilliant an deep thoughts expressed on DP, I should take time and find them again, but the fact is that atheists did not comprehend them anyway and made reefedjib loose his patience. I just wanted to comment that he shouldn’t expect atheists to comprehend most simple sentences, to answer most simple questions. I wanted to tell him that I enjoyed, appreciated and learned . He should learn not to let atheists to bring him back to clichés and standard thinking. It does not matter, he or she or it at the moment, there is no need to get involved into sidetracks. He should learn that scourge only wants to exhaust one’s patience. Also when he goes into non-Christian BS – energy, matter etc, he looses brilliance and follows BS, I just wanted to remind him that his Hindu beliefs contradict physics, go against physics, in all of all who did make physics- Christians or Hindu? He actually showed a natural thinking of a physicist, of Newton and Einstein type. I enjoyed and learned. Then he lost to Hindu…

    Anyway, I like when atheists think that they need to show up on a debate and make this intellectual statement – ‘’I don’t care’’. What a misery.
    I'm not an atheist.

    I think the closest would be agnostic.

    I don't know, and know I probably can't know something unknowable, but I can't bring myself to commit to something I don't know, even though I know I can't know anything.

    Is that clearer?

    I was brought up Christian, so don't know if it is lingering "indoctrination" or my own thoughts (or a combination of the two) that bring me to the position of believing that a god of some sort may exist, but not knowing, and thus...being stuck somewhere in the middle.
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  4. #264
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by justone View Post
    I would say that you have missed some of most brilliant an deep thoughts expressed on DP, I should take time and find them again, but the fact is that atheists did not comprehend them anyway and made reefedjib loose his patience.
    You are aware that the Oscars are over and you didn't win any prizes for lamest comedy, aren't you?

    Quote Originally Posted by justone View Post
    Let me ask you a simple question. If you think that the universe… I wouldn’t even ask you to explain how one can think so… let’s say it always has been, - then who made it start heading to the end, to death, non-existence all over suddenly?
    See, if you had the ability to understand the arguments, and because you have "religion", you can't understand them, you wouldn't have been able to make the above blisteringly ignorant response after reading twenty six pages of dialogue that put reefedjib in his place. For example, you're confusng the entropic cycle of this observed bubble of space-time with the "universe", either deliberately or ignorantly assuming that our arguments about what Philip Jose Farmer neatly termed the "pluriverse" were directly applicable to the single "universe" that we are able to percieve with our evolved senses.

    Since it was clearly pointed out that since this "universe" had a clearly definable origin in time, it must exist as a subset of some other more eternal space and time coordinate frame. The complete lack of evidence of intelligent origin or operation of this observed space we occupy presents no basis for assuming the larger pluriverse has any intelligence driving it's course. Indeed, absolutely nothing is observable about the course, or lack thereof, of the greater space-time continuum of which we theorize must exist.

    To presume that greater space-time has an intelligent aspect is merest hubris on your part.

    This universe came into existence, it will die, at absolute zero, in the far future. There is no reason to suspect that it has any reason for existing whatsoever. And books written by neolithic sheep herders intent on imbuing their patriarchal societies with their God's Approval don't count as evidence.
    Last edited by Scarecrow Akhbar; 03-08-10 at 04:14 AM.

  5. #265
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by justone View Post
    You are correct. This is exactly what I said. Are you be surprised that it had to be explained by you to some who thinks that they are educated? Do you think they understood?

    I have not been to France. All friends of mine are negative in their experience. But you make me think… – in the US they teach only atheism in schools and colleges. Do they still teach how to count in France? Or it is just somewhere from your family, when France used to be a center of culture?
    No... Yes...

    Yes... No...

    PS: Im an atheist by the way

  6. #266
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    I always wondered why (for instance) the Christian religion feels threatened by the thought of the Big Bang or Evolution. Couldn't these be a result of actions by God? I believe so. I mean no one REALLY knows how we came into being... not even those who wrote they Testaments in the Bible. They weren't there when Earth was created after all. And history could easily be changed with writing on paper. Why is the bible the final say?

    For all we know the people at South Park got it right ("Canceled" episode)

  7. #267
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    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

    Questioning or criticizing another's core beliefs is inadvertently perceived as offensive and rude.

  8. #268
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Well "time" would essentially be just a label we have given something right?

    Its a damn good question though. The idea of "time" exists because we humans are perceptive beings, if we were not that perceptive or introspective, or what have you, then time would not have been an idea in the first place.

    Wait ... what?


  9. #269
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    Veni, vidi, dormivi!

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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    thats like saying theres no such thing as distance because we use human methods to measure it, or that if every being on earth closed its eyes at the same time, light would not exist.
    So follow me into the desert
    As desperate as you are
    Where the moon is glued to a picture of heaven
    And all the little pigs have God

  10. #270
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    Re: Where did the Universe come from?

    Quote Originally Posted by justone View Post
    Sure, it is just your dream. You are dreaming of me too. Actually I am not even typing, I am only in your personal imagination.



    The answer is – the OP was written by a very intelligent man. reefedjib provided me with joy to seeing a man who has abilities to think and think independently and quite brilliantly. My original intent was to compliment him, but I was too tired and couldn’t get to those few posts which gave the joy of observing human intelligence.

    Obviously he did expect a conversation on intelligent level somewhat close to his level. I just wanted to tell him that he should get used to the fact that it will not happen any time when he wants to mention God. One indeed has to have a hell of patience talking to atheists, when atheists do not understand a simple thought, phrase, and sentence. So, he shouldn’t start swearing and coursing.I know it takes a hell of patience, but I for instance remind to myself that I also used to be an atheist when my mind and intellect was not developed.

    Obviously he did not think about including option which could come to minds of people with undeveloped intellect and infant comprehension of reality. He covered all even slightly reasonable options.
    .This exactly what my dog thinks and comprehends about reality around him.
    Why did the author of OP have to count in this level of comprehension of reality?


    Let me ask you a simple question. If you think that the universe… I wouldn’t even ask you to explain how one can think so… let’s say it always has been, - then who made it start heading to the end, to death, non-existence all over suddenly?
    In other words - because people here have stated or tried to state their own thoughts on the topic, you feel justified in coming forth and insulting and belittling these people.

    So we don't believe as you do, therefore we are stupid and not capable of intelligent thought.

    How nice and open minded of you. For being familiar with the OP and stating that he is an intelligent person that would love an intelligent debate, you single handedly killed the topic.

    Congratulations on your*own* lack of intelligent contribution - exactly doing what you've accused others here of - at least the rest of us came to the thread with some sort of on-topic relevance.

    Love,
    An Atheist
    Last edited by TheGirlNextDoor; 03-11-10 at 08:52 AM.
    Fool me once, shame on you.
    Fool me twice....shame on me.

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