Last edited by jamesrage; 02-28-10 at 08:29 PM.
"A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"
Cicero Marcus Tullius
Rights, as objective, demonstrable things are fantasy. They simply do not exist. No one has yet shown how you determine what a "right" is in any objective manner.
Psst... dont tell anyone but its because they're a bunch of reactionists to our secret socialist revolution where we plan to enslave the rich and give all these things out for free.Pardon my hippie mind, why are people saying that they aren't rights?
Well, duh. Why can't you answer my question? Why must every "debate" on this forum be an attempt to "win" the internetz?...anyone can define whatever they want as "righteous" and "moral", therefore you're back to just demanding that what you want is a "right". Until you can objectively come up with a definition of what a "right" is and how it can be objectively determined, you're still just whistling dixie.
Do you agree with Jefferson's conception of liberty, and do you think it is a valid moral basis for our society? I'm asking because I want to know, not because I like asking random questions.
For example, I could prove that I have a right in the care, control and custody of my children. I could provide various personal court documents, statutes, and many specific examples where I have exorcised this right.
Also, I can demonstrate various rights as a tenant. I could provide the rental agreement, more statutes on tenant rights, and specific occasions where I have exorcised that authority.
If a right is a collection of qualities that together constitute the ideal of moral propriety or merit moral approval, then once those qualities are clearly defined, we could look at a given person and observe rather or not they fit the criteria and posses that right. Take gay marriage, for example. Gays don't currently have the right to marry because they don't meet the criteria. The solution: Change the criteria. In this way it is demonstrated that rights exist.
If, however, a right is something someone can do even though sometimes they shouldn't, then anything one can do is therefore a right.
Its not a question of enslaving...but unless you are simply refusing to see the truth, Obama...democrats...politicians...even Biden (hes not REALLY a player) have all said they want to give away MORE and they absolutely believe the wealthy should pay for it.
ANd they HAVE to give away more of other peoples money. How else do you continue to create more crippled and dependent little pets to keep dems in power?
IT comes down to the rule of law. People create the rules that govern their society. As long as they live in that society they follow those rules and enjoy those 'rights' and freedoms...right up until someone attempts to take the 'right' from them.
People have the 'right' to live. Every year a few hundred thousand Americans have that right violated. But...how can that BE if it is a 'right?'
Maybe we better do a more effective job of defining the word 'right'