View Poll Results: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

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  • Stupid.

    28 21.21%
  • Losers.

    22 16.67%
  • Immoral.

    4 3.03%
  • Not my concern.

    54 40.91%
  • Normal.

    37 28.03%
  • Awesome!

    20 15.15%
  • Confused.

    18 13.64%
  • Hungry.

    29 21.97%
  • Drowsy.

    12 9.09%
  • Other.

    29 21.97%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

  1. #131
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    Re: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    That's exactly how it's classified. Children who:

    • Fails to give close attention to details or makes careless mistakes.
    • Has difficulty sustaining attention.
    • Does not appear to listen.
    • Struggles to follow through on instructions.
    • Has difficulty with organization.
    • Avoids or dislikes tasks requiring sustained mental effort.
    • Loses things.
    • Is easily distracted.
    • Is forgetful in daily activities.


    ...are not psychologically disordered. They just don't like the specific activity which they are being forced to engage in. Put them in front of a video game and suddenly their ADHD disappears. How can a psychological disorder only apply in certain situations?



    I'm not even talking about "excessive" usage of prescription medicine. Hundreds of thousands of people have died from regular usage. How many people have died from excessive marijuana use?

    To be clear, I'm not saying marijuana doesn't have any negative health effects (it certainly does) but I think you are exaggerating its dangers. I have literally smoked marijuana thousands of times and I'm intelligent and very athletic. Would I be more intelligent and athletic if I had never smoked marijuana? Certainly possible, but excessive marijuana usage is far less dangerous than regular usage of prescription medicine, which makes your demonization of it unnecessary.
    You forgot to include an important part for the diagnosis:

    Additional Requirements for the Diagnosis of ADD/ADHD:

    1. The symptoms must be to a degree that is "maladaptive and inconsistent with development level."

    This part is highly subjective. Remember: Just because a behavior appears to be maladaptive, it doesn't necessarily mean a child actually has some sort of brain defect, as proved by Thomas Edison's remarkable career after being kicked out of school for his divergent thinking traits. Gifted students may also display behavior that is "maladaptive" but they certainly do not have a disorder or brain defect. Parents and professionals alike should not only judge the child's behavior, but also their own expectations of conformity and convenience. Because children become less impulsive as they get older, a child who is naturally more impulsive than others will appear to be "developmentally behind."

    2. "Some impairment from the symptoms is present in two or more settings." If a child is only having problems in school, then the DSM IV criteria have not been met. The wording, however, is so vague that just about anything can be considered impairment by someone who is looking for it. If you report that it is difficult to get your child to clean up his room, or that you have a lot of trouble getting him to do his homework, this may be taken as a sign of "some impairment," when both traits are very normal for divergent thinkers. An astute parent, however, can make a solid argument against an ADD diagnosis if he or she has not had significant problems with the child outside of school.

    3. "There must be clear evidence of clinically significant impairment in social, academic or occupational functioning."

    There are some children who really do have severe dysfunction. But if a bright but bored student gets only C's, is that "clinically significant impairment"? Many would argue yes. Others would argue no. It is this ambiguity that can lead to high levels of diagnoses. In Greenwich, Connecticut, one of the wealthiest cities in the U.S., 30% of all school kids have been diagnosed with some type of learning disability, qualifying them for additional school resources like one-on-one tutors.

    4. "The symptoms are not better accounted for by another mental disorder." Depression and anxiety are often overlooked in kids, but they can mimic many of the traits of ADD. Inability to concentrate can be severe in kids or adults with depression and anxiety. Sometimes kids are being bullied in school and don't want to tell anyone, so they may become depressed or anxious and can appear to have ADD without hyperactivity.

    5. The symptoms that cause impairment must have been present before the age of 7. If your sweet child never had a problem until his third grade teacher insisted he be tested for ADD because he won't sit still, then the DSM IV criteria have not been met. However, in "real life" there are people who acquire ADD as a result of brain trauma.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

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  2. #132
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    Re: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    My nephew is ADHD(was maybe, we have grown out of touch, so not sure). Ritalin was the difference between him being basically destructive, and being close to in control.
    I'm not trying to be offensive, but your nephew was probably just a brat. I was too...

    While I am certainly not going to argue that ADD/ADHD is not way overdiagnosed, that does not mean it is not a real issue for some people. Thankfully, my nephew seems to finally have his life straitened out to an extent, but his childhood and teen years where a complete nightmare for my sister.
    It's always about the parent, isn't it? My kid won't listen to me so I'll just lobotomize them with drugs.

  3. #133
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    Re: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post



    And I disagree. Regular, prescribed usage of prescription medication is far less dangerous than excessive usage of marijuana. With marijuana, when smoked, you have the smoking inhalation issues to content with. You also have the addiction issue to contend with, and issue that does not occur with the vast majority of prescription meds. Also, research certainly shows that excessive use of marijuana causes problems with memory, concentration, and other brain functions. Your glorification of marijuana is completely inaccurate.
    You forgot an important one: people using prescription drugs are monitored by doctors. People who are using marijuana, not so much.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

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  4. #134
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    Re: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    I'm not trying to be offensive, but your nephew was probably just a brat. I was too...



    It's always about the parent, isn't it? My kid won't listen to me so I'll just lobotomize them with drugs.
    No, he was not. The difference was a difference of degree. Trust me, it was there. He did not do what he did because he was a brat, or as my sister put it "a spawn of satan", he did things because he wanted to make things happen. He needed to make things happen in fact.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  5. #135
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    Re: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Because we all know success in academics is important enough to prescribe powerful drugs to children.
    Absolutely is at times, since, statistically, there is a direct correlation between success in academics and success post-school



    I met the criteria to a T.
    OK, so perhaps you are ADD.

    Why not? While I was on Ritalin I got straight A's and behaved very well in class.
    Good. So either it WAS the right medication for you, the side effects you suffered made it the WRONG medication for you, or you are allowing your personal position on this to cloud the rationality of the situation.

    I suspect you are not telling us the whole story, but that is your right.



    Whatever they are, they shouldn't be given to children for "ADHD". The best cure is good parenting.
    Wrong. Good parenting is ALWAYS helpful, but when one is suffering from a psychological disorder, other help needs to be put in place.
    Last edited by CaptainCourtesy; 02-22-10 at 03:57 AM.
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    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  6. #136
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    Re: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    You forgot to include an important part for the diagnosis:
    Like I said, distress and problematic. Ethereal seems to think that because the criteria sounds like many typical kids, the diagnosis is faulty. What he doesn't understand is that a lot more goes into a diagnosis than just looking at generalized criteria.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  7. #137
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    Re: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    [/LIST]
    And nothing here about boredom or being defiant/oppositional. The latter is a completely different diagnosis. You are wrong about this.
    Just because they didn't use the exact same terms as me does not undercut my original point. These "symptoms" are nothing more than a list of things people do when they're uninterested or defiant.

    Yeah, they are disordered, if they meet the criteria. And people who are diagnosed as depressed do laugh and enjoy things at times. Folks with psychological disorders are diagnosed based on the consistency/persistence of the symptoms and the amount of distress/problems that these symptoms cause.
    How can a psychological disorder disappear completely when you're doing something you enjoy?

    And I disagree. Regular, prescribed usage of prescription medication is far less dangerous than excessive usage of marijuana.
    Then you're just wrong. There isn't a single proven case of someone dying from excessive marijuana usage (although there is strong evidence it causes cancer), yet there are literally hundreds of thousands of people who have died from regular prescription drug use. If you have some data that disproves these facts I'd be happy to take a look at it.

    With marijuana, when smoked, you have the smoking inhalation issues to content with. You also have the addiction issue to contend with, and issue that does not occur with the vast majority of prescription meds. Also, research certainly shows that excessive use of marijuana causes problems with memory, concentration, and other brain functions. Your glorification of marijuana is completely inaccurate.
    I'm not glorifying marijuana. It is dangerous (far less dangerous than prescription drug use), just not as dangerous as you think.

  8. #138
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    Re: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Absolutely is at times, since, statistically, there is a direct correlation between success in academics and success post-school.
    Why does the problem have to be with the child's psyche? Why can't it be the school system or lack of good parenting?

    OK, so perhaps you are ADD.
    Why? Because I'm not interested in what some authority figure has to say about geometry?

    Good. So either it WAS the right medication for you, the side effects you suffered made it the WRONG medication for you, or you are allowing your personal position on this to cloud the rationality of the situation.

    I suspect you are not telling us the whole story, but that is your right.
    Of course. My personal situation undercuts the status quo so I must be lying.

    And what side effects are you talking about? My suffering was a consequence of the drug's intended purpose, not some side effect.

    Wrong. Good parenting is ALWAYS helpful, but when one is suffering from a psychological disorder, other help needs to be put in place.
    Yes, and this help can only be administered by paid professionals. We need them to fix us, make us right...

  9. #139
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    Re: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Just because they didn't use the exact same terms as me does not undercut my original point. These "symptoms" are nothing more than a list of things people do when they're uninterested or defiant.
    You do not understand the dynamics of diagnosis. Those symptoms MUST be coupled with a level of distress or problematic behavior that impairs functioning. This is not defiant behavior being described.



    How can a psychological disorder disappear completely when you're doing something you enjoy?
    The disorder doesn't disappear. Think about it like this. If you have sciatica, the pain may come in waves, or it may happen when you move a certain way. Doesn't change the fact that, even though you may NOT be in pain at times, you still have sciatica. Same thing with a broken leg. Mental illness is SO misunderstood and poorly presented by most lay people, that those who suffer from something get labeled as either "crazy" or "faking"... the latter of which you seem to be doing.



    Then you're just wrong. There isn't a single proven case of someone dying from excessive marijuana usage (although there is strong evidence it causes cancer), yet there are literally hundreds of thousands of people who have died from regular prescription drug use. If you have some data that disproves these facts I'd be happy to take a look at it.
    And I'm not talking about death. That is not the ONLY negative thing that can occur. You are wrong... regular use of prescription meds, statistically, is far less dangerous than excessive use of marijuana. Plenty of folks are on long term meds with no or minimal side effects. Use marijuana excessively for a long period of time, and you will have a negative reaction.



    I'm not glorifying marijuana. It is dangerous (far less dangerous than prescription drug use), just not as dangerous as you think.
    Then you're glorifying because it is far more dangerous, in the scenario we are discussing, then prescription drug use.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  10. #140
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    Re: People Who Smoke Marijuana Are...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Why does the problem have to be with the child's psyche? Why can't it be the school system or lack of good parenting?
    These can be components, of course. But there are certainly valid tests that show that, for some, it is about the child's psyche.



    Why? Because I'm not interested in what some authority figure has to say about geometry?
    No, that wouldn't do it. If you met the criteria, and it was causing you distress/problems that inhibited your functioning, then the diagnosis was accurate. Since I did not assess you, I have no idea whether it was or not, but the two criteria you mentioned above are not enough.



    Of course. My personal situation undercuts the status quo so I must be lying.
    I didn't say that. I'm assuming that there is more to the story than you are saying... there always is. It seems that your personal position on this has an impact on your ability to understand how diagnosis work.

    And what side effects are you talking about? My suffering was a consequence of the drug's intended purpose, not some side effect.
    So, what were your consequences? More ability to focus, better grades, fewer problems in school? Must have been horrible for you.



    Yes, and this help can only be administered by paid professionals. We need them to fix us, make us right...
    Since not everyone knows how to do everything, absolutely. If you don't know how to fix your car, you hire a paid professional to fix it.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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