View Poll Results: Should the census count illegals? Post a Poll

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    10 32.26%
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Thread: Should the census count illegals?

  1. #31
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    Re: Should the census count illegals?

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    James you need to qualify this poll. Count illegals for what purpose, just to see how many there are, count them as part of the population, or what? That would leave the problem of how to find them in order to count them. Good luck.
    I agree with this. I think they should be counted just to see how many there are but not be counted in terms of benefits given out. I'm not really sure how well that would work though.
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  2. #32
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    Re: Should the census count illegals?

    Of course they should be counted. You might not like the fact that they're here, but they ARE here.

    The census is like the bathroom scale: Its job is to give accurate measurements. You may not like the results, but you don't pass a law to artificially change them.
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  3. #33
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    Re: Should the census count illegals?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Of course they should be counted. You might not like the fact that they're here, but they ARE here.

    The census is like the bathroom scale: Its job is to give accurate measurements. You may not like the results, but you don't pass a law to artificially change them.
    When they started the census originally, it wasn't crafted with such intrusive questions such as family income and worth.

    It is now used as a general guide on disbursing federal dollars.
    The context has changed and they shouldn't be counted because they may not even stay.
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  4. #34
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    Re: Should the census count illegals?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    When they started the census originally, it wasn't crafted with such intrusive questions such as family income and worth.

    It is now used as a general guide on disbursing federal dollars.
    The context has changed and they shouldn't be counted because they may not even stay.
    We might have added some questions in order to give us a better idea of how to distribute money, but that doesn't change the fact that the constitutionally required purpose of the census is to apportion representation, for which it requires a count of all persons.

    I don't see anything wrong with using two different sets of numbers - citizens + illegals for determining representation, and citizens for distributing benefits.
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  5. #35
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    Re: Should the census count illegals?

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    We might have added some questions in order to give us a better idea of how to distribute money, but that doesn't change the fact that the constitutionally required purpose of the census is to apportion representation, for which it requires a count of all persons.

    I don't see anything wrong with using two different sets of numbers - citizens + illegals for determining representation, and citizens for distributing benefits.
    I don't care if illegals are here but they have no right to representation, none at all.
    They have no right to government benefits either.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  6. #36
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    Re: Should the census count illegals?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    I don't care if illegals are here but they have no right to representation, none at all.
    They have no right to government benefits either.
    That's a perfectly valid policy argument, but the Constitution explicitly requires that they be counted for purposes of representation.
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  7. #37
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    Re: Should the census count illegals?

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    That's a perfectly valid policy argument, but the Constitution explicitly requires that they be counted for purposes of representation.
    You can't vote unless your a citizen, so it legally doesn't fit.

    You can't choose your representative if your here illegally.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  8. #38
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    Re: Should the census count illegals?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    You can't vote unless your a citizen, so it legally doesn't fit.

    You can't choose your representative if your here illegally.
    They clearly contemplated this:

    Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice-President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.
    They specifically draw distinctions between persons and citizens, saying that all persons must be counted for representation, but only citizens get to vote.

    There is plenty of legislative history to support this conclusion as well:

    http://www.thecensusproject.org/fact...ensus-memo.pdf
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  9. #39
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    Re: Should the census count illegals?

    Quote Originally Posted by Partisan View Post
    While the INDIGENOUS Indians pretty much get a free ride, I'm OK with that...
    It is the illegal Indians from south of the border I have a problem with....
    Indigenous cultural boundaries are not formed by national divisions. Or have you already forgotten this?



    I suppose you've never heard of the Jay Treaty regarding the U.S.-Canada border or the Tohono O'odham nation, or even the "binational" Apache. That tends to happen when you watch The Road to El Dorado too many times and assume that every redskin south of the border is an "Aztec."

    Quote Originally Posted by Partisan View Post
    & let's not forget the illegal asians as well.....
    Or better yet, the illegal Europeans. I think you'd be happier in your homeland, anchor baby.

    Quote Originally Posted by Partisan View Post
    Glad to see they got the power restored on the Rez, Chief.....
    The Mescalero reservation is in New Mexico. Since you apparently read user profiles with the same proficiency as posts, I live in Arizona, within the confines of the Navajo reservation, but as I'm certainly not a Navajo, I'm afraid I wouldn't be a chief, lad.

  10. #40
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    Re: Should the census count illegals?

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    They clearly contemplated this:

    They specifically draw distinctions between persons and citizens, saying that all persons must be counted for representation, but only citizens get to vote.

    There is plenty of legislative history to support this conclusion as well:

    http://www.thecensusproject.org/fact...ensus-memo.pdf
    Then whats the point of counting them, if they aren't represented and they aren't allowed to receive benefits what purpose does it serve?
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

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