View Poll Results: You can't spend your way out of a recession

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  • Agree, you can't (generally)

    42 44.68%
  • Disagree, you can (generally)

    52 55.32%
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Thread: You can't spend your way out of a recession

  1. #51
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    Re: You can't spend your way out of a recession

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Wow. Have you ever read anything from that school? Seriously, anything?
    You mean the non applicable theory of the firm? Oh boy did i, and i was quite unimpressed.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  2. #52
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    Re: You can't spend your way out of a recession

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Agree or disagree?
    Agree generally.. as far as simple economic cycles.

    But you HAVE to Spend/Bail/Borrow-and-steal your way out of the Depression we almost had just a year+ ago.

    Of course the 1930's spending after the 1929 Depression was successful to some extent and got some people working again...

    But it wasn't until the Huge Public spending of World War II that we actually DID spend our way back to prosperity.
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  3. #53
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    Re: You can't spend your way out of a recession

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Completely disagree. In fact, spending is the ONLY way to get out of a recession. A recession is pretty much defined by the lack of spending.
    Hogwash. You cant 'spend your way out of a recession'...you merely dig a deeper hole that someone else has to pay for.

    Artificially propping up an economy doesnt stimulate growth. Cutting government, tightening belts, and allowing the private sector to build is the only way to get out of a recession.

    A year after the stimulous packages, the states are back to being out of money, they didnt do anything to fix their problem, and we have another few trillion tacked onto the back end of our national debt...

  4. #54
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    Re: You can't spend your way out of a recession

    for what it is worth...

    the only people clamoring for more government spending are the ones that have proven they simply havent a clue how to be successful.

  5. #55
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    Re: You can't spend your way out of a recession

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    for what it is worth...

    the only people clamoring for more government spending are the ones that have proven they simply havent a clue how to be successful.
    Wrong.....

    Unless of course the markets are wrong?
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  6. #56
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    Re: You can't spend your way out of a recession

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Everyone fails at the same time?
    Absolutely. Why is that so unthinkable? Why is it the default assumption that markets would always be perfectly rational and efficient? Lots of people do the same stupid things under the same circumstances.

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez
    How is that even possible? What is the cause of systemic failures in the marketplace?
    Predictably irrational behavior on the part of individuals. We see this in other forms of human behavior, so why would economics be an exception?

    If the government was the only variable here, then there wouldn't have been a crash in the housing market. Government policies changed very little until AFTER the bubble had burst.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 02-16-10 at 04:03 PM.
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  7. #57
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    Re: You can't spend your way out of a recession

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Artificially propping up an economy doesnt stimulate growth.
    Then how does spending artificially prop up the economy, if not by stimulating growth?

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack
    Cutting government, tightening belts, and allowing the private sector to build is the only way to get out of a recession.
    We have gotten out of recessions before without doing those things.

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack
    A year after the stimulous packages, the states are back to being out of money, they didnt do anything to fix their problem,
    Sounds like a good case for another dose of stimulus.

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack
    and we have another few trillion tacked onto the back end of our national debt...
    The short-term debt we're incurring as a cost of fighting the recession is not very worrisome. What is much more concerning is the long-term component of our deficit, especially entitlements.
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  8. #58
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    Re: You can't spend your way out of a recession

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Agree or disagree?
    If you mean government spending, then no. All this does is run up debt, leading to bigger problems down the road.

    If you mean spendng in the private sector, then yes. The idea is to properly stuimulate that spending, which is best done by people being allowed to keep, and then spend, more of their own money.

    What a silly thought, 'allowing' people to keep ther own money.

  9. #59
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    Re: You can't spend your way out of a recession

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Wrong.....

    Unless of course the markets are wrong?
    How is that unemployment rate doing? How is the housing market coming? Booming right?

    This MAY be lost on you...but the markets are basically run by investors...people that already HAVE money. Wealthy people tend to do OK...and in fact often thrive...in down markets.

    id be much more impressed if the 'real' unemployment rates werent around 19%. Id feel more comforted if cities like detroit werent facing 35% unemployment (real unemployment...you know...the rates that include people no longer eligible for jobless benefits).

  10. #60
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    Re: You can't spend your way out of a recession

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Then how does spending artificially prop up the economy, if not by stimulating growth?



    We have gotten out of recessions before without doing those things.



    Sounds like a good case for another dose of stimulus.



    The short-term debt we're incurring as a cost of fighting the recession is not very worrisome. What is much more concerning is the long-term component of our deficit, especially entitlements.
    Good lord...really???

    Lets see...California was on the verge of bankruptcy...we debt loaned them a chunk in stimulus dollars. That money is gone and they are back to facing the original layoffs...

    We temporarily staved off a bottoming housing market by artificially bouying up the housing market and banks. Now foreclosures are once again on the rise, homes arent being built, housing costs are still artificially inflated depressing the markets...

    The stimulous dollars havent 'created' a single job. They HAVE allowed state and locals that were already failing to tax and spend appropriately to keep people employed (the 'saved' part of created or saved jobs) and when those dollars are gone all we have left is a hole.

    Things have to get worse before they get better. sad reality. Cuts have to be made. Private industry needs to be encouraged to build and grow. We need cooperative efforts between labor, business and yes, government to bring back the industrial base skilled jobs. The housing prices need to be allowed to correct (and yes...that means people will temporarily lose property value) so that people can afford to buy again.

    Deficit spending isnt creating jobs. It is 'saving' governments from having to be responsible.

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