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Would Gene-Engineering Humans be contrary to "God's Plan" or "Evolution?"

Would Gene-Engineering Humans be contrary to "God's Plan" or "Evolution?"

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The Mark

The Mark

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Would Gene-Engineering Humans be contrary to "God's Plan" or "Evolution?"

By this I mean, if we humans develop the ability to manipulate our own Genes/DNA to the point that we can make changes (for good or bad), would this be contrary to any given arbitrary "Devine Entity Plan" or "Natural Evolutionary Process?"

It seems to me that it could be, in the first case, simply part of said plan, or in the second case, part of the "Evolutionary Process."

Thoughts?
 
The Mark said:
Would Gene-Engineering Humans be contrary to "God's Plan" or "Evolution?"

By this I mean, if we humans develop the ability to manipulate our own Genes/DNA to the point that we can make changes (for good or bad), would this be contrary to any given arbitrary "Devine Entity Plan" or "Natural Evolutionary Process?"

It seems to me that it could be, in the first case, simply part of said plan, or in the second case, part of the "Evolutionary Process."

Thoughts?
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I think gene-engineering would be a wonderful thing. I am in a genetics course right now in college and we have been talking some about gene therapy. I don't support eugenics or sterilizing people because of their genotype, but I do support genetic therapy in the sense of turning off disease causing genes and adding genes that would improve a person's quality of life. Things are very promising in this field, scientists are now looking to find ways to use viruses to deliver genetic material into the living cells of individuals to treat disease and even to stop cancer. I am all for gene-engineering and I don't think it is contrary to "God's Plan" sense it is improving our quality of life and treating disease. I also don't think it's contrary to evolution, if it's all about survival of the fittest genetics I don't see how it would go against the dogma of evolutionary biology and natural selection.
 
If you believe in God, wouldn't it make sense that anything we did would be part of God's experiment? After all, we'd be using the brains he gave us, right? If he didn't want us to be able to do something, wouldn't he have made us unable to do that by limiting our intelligence, or some other road block?

I never bought into that idea that God is watching everybody every second of their life. Like the athlete, when interviewed after the competition says "I owe it all to blah blah blah my lord and savior". As IF their savior helped THEM to win and helped to PREVENT the other guy or team from winning.
 
digsbe said:
I think gene-engineering would be a wonderful thing. I am in a genetics course right now in college and we have been talking some about gene therapy. I don't support eugenics or sterilizing people because of their genotype, but I do support genetic therapy in the sense of turning off disease causing genes and adding genes that would improve a person's quality of life. Things are very promising in this field; scientists are now looking to find ways to use viruses to deliver genetic material into the living cells of individuals to treat disease and even to stop cancer. I am all for gene-engineering and I don't think it isn't contrary to "God's Plan" sense it is improving our quality of life and treating disease. I also don't think it's contrary to evolution, if it's all about survival of the fittest genetics I don't see how it would go against the dogma of evolutionary biology and natural selection.
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Excellent.

I wonder, however, what kind of safeguards will be needed to prevent unscrupulous persons from half-***ing some gene engineering and causing problems?
 
The Mark said:
Excellent.

I wonder, however, what kind of safeguards will be needed to prevent unscrupulous persons from half-***ing some gene engineering and causing problems?
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I guess the only safeguards would be multiple checks to ensure a correct sequence. One nucleotide can throw off an entire protein and effect it's function. If we engineer a gene incorrectly we could be causing serious harm to the patient instead of helping them. The only thing I can really think of now is a peer review process for each genetic sequence for every individual treatment, and maybe also an institution that would oversee genetic engineering.
 
The Mark said:
Would Gene-Engineering Humans be contrary to "God's Plan" or "Evolution?"

By this I mean, if we humans develop the ability to manipulate our own Genes/DNA to the point that we can make changes (for good or bad), would this be contrary to any given arbitrary "Devine Entity Plan" or "Natural Evolutionary Process?"

It seems to me that it could be, in the first case, simply part of said plan, or in the second case, part of the "Evolutionary Process."

Thoughts?
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Well, gene engineering isn't how biological evolution works. But biological evolution is too slow. I think that from here on out, almost all evolution will be done by artificial means.

So to answer your question, I guess it depends how you're defining evolution.
 
Kandahar said:
Well, gene engineering isn't how biological evolution works. But biological evolution is too slow. I think that from here on out, almost all evolution will be done by artificial means.

So to answer your question, I guess it depends how you're defining evolution.
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I was actually thinking in terms of "we have evolved to the point that we can alter ourselves", or something.
 
The Mark said:
I was actually thinking in terms of "we have evolved to the point that we can alter ourselves", or something.
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In that case, I would agree that its the logical progression of evolution. Not that it matters much IMO. Whether or not it's natural should have no bearing on whether or not it's a good idea.
 
Kandahar said:
In that case, I would agree that its the logical progression of evolution. Not that it matters much IMO. Whether or not it's natural should have no bearing on whether or not it's a good idea.
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True.

I personally think that, with enough safeguards to protect against misuse, it could be a greatly helpful development.

But there would still be instances of misuse...

I suppose it's a case of "lesser of two evils". I think developing it would be the lesser. One of the reasons I think so is that, eventually, someone is going to develop it anyway. So it would be better to have the ability to repair/counter any negative effects.
 
I don't believe in god, so I can't really answer that part of it. It would certainly go against the natural mechanisms of evolution though.

As far as whether it's a good idea, at this point it's hard to say. It could be the best thing that's ever happened to us, or the worst.
 
The Mark said:
True.

I personally think that, with enough safeguards to protect against misuse, it could be a greatly helpful development.

But there would still be instances of misuse...

I suppose it's a case of "lesser of two evils". I think developing it would be the lesser. One of the reasons I think so is that, eventually, someone is going to develop it anyway. So it would be better to have the ability to repair/counter any negative effects.
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Unfortunately genetically engineered humans would be the providence of those that could afford it. It would be all to likely that it would bring about a Nietzschean Ubermensch based on social status and wealth. Those born with a silver spoon will now also have "golden genes" as well.

moral issues aside, potential social issues and a new stratification of humans and "superhuman" overlords are the potential ramifications that are most bothersome in my opinion.
 
marduc said:
Unfortunately genetically engineered humans would be the providence of those that could afford it. It would be all to likely that it would bring about a Nietzschean Ubermensch based on social status and wealth. Those born with a silver spoon will now also have "golden genes" as well.

moral issues aside, potential social issues and a new stratification of humans and "superhuman" overlords are the potential ramifications that are most bothersome in my opinion.
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But, if the possibility for gene-engineered humans (not to mention other things) exists, it would seem inevitable that someone would attempt what you fear, no matter the preventative measures put in place. I would much rather full understanding of the processes involved be developed than not, in the case of such occurring.
 
The Mark said:
Would Gene-Engineering Humans be contrary to "God's Plan" or "Evolution?"

By this I mean, if we humans develop the ability to manipulate our own Genes/DNA to the point that we can make changes (for good or bad), would this be contrary to any given arbitrary "Devine Entity Plan" or "Natural Evolutionary Process?"

It seems to me that it could be, in the first case, simply part of said plan, or in the second case, part of the "Evolutionary Process."

Thoughts?
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It seems so from where I'm standing, but only God himself could say for sure.
 
Jerry said:
It seems so from where I'm standing, but only God himself could say for sure.
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Perhaps.

But if so, what do we lowly humans do, without such omniscience on the subject?
 
genetic engineering should be limited to medicinal uses.

however im sure governments would like to put it to military use.
 
The Mark said:
Would Gene-Engineering Humans be contrary to "God's Plan" or "Evolution?"

By this I mean, if we humans develop the ability to manipulate our own Genes/DNA to the point that we can make changes (for good or bad), would this be contrary to any given arbitrary "Devine Entity Plan" or "Natural Evolutionary Process?"

It seems to me that it could be, in the first case, simply part of said plan, or in the second case, part of the "Evolutionary Process."

Thoughts?
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"If you give the ability you give your concent"
 
Jerry said:
I don't know...go to work, keep pay'n the bills I guess.
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I mean if the ability to manipulate human genes is developed, how do we attempt to preven misuse? Or do we try at all?
 
The Mark said:
But, if the possibility for gene-engineered humans (not to mention other things) exists, it would seem inevitable that someone would attempt what you fear, no matter the preventative measures put in place. I would much rather full understanding of the processes involved be developed than not, in the case of such occurring.
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I do agree that it would seem inevitable, and actually made no claims on what we should or should not do, or if we should try to delay, or thwart genetic tinkering.

There are a ton of scenarios and questions this brings up, and for me, none of the questions are based on whether or not it is contrary to some grander pre ordained design, whether it be God or evolution.

I am worried that unless we proceed with EXTREME caution the ramifications could be way more than we bargained for, but that never stops us, and so long as we are fractured into 200 or so nations even if most decide to ban all research and all manipulation, someone somewhere will go full steam ahead.

What to do and how to deal with this?? I cannot tell you, but I fear the potential consequences if we thrust forward in typical human fashion with reckless abandon. Even proceeding with extreme caution is fraught with peril.
 
Would it be contrary to evolution? Yes, but our medical science has already done this. Physically we are passing on weak genetic material because they are not dying off.

As for God, I doubt it. He already knows the future so that would make it part of his plan.
 
The Mark said:
Would Gene-Engineering Humans be contrary to "God's Plan" or "Evolution?"

By this I mean, if we humans develop the ability to manipulate our own Genes/DNA to the point that we can make changes (for good or bad), would this be contrary to any given arbitrary "Devine Entity Plan" or "Natural Evolutionary Process?"

It seems to me that it could be, in the first case, simply part of said plan, or in the second case, part of the "Evolutionary Process."

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

I gotta ask, what do you mean by natural evolutionary processes?
 
Nothing is ever "contrary to" evolution. That's not how it works.
 
First of all, let's prove god's existence before we play hopscotch on each other.

The fact that humans are smart enough to come up with this technology is a clear example of evolution.
 
repeter said:
I gotta ask, what do you mean by natural evolutionary processes?
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Well, whatever process evolution takes. I suppose some persons might try to say gene-engineering humans might be "unnatural evolution", or something. Such was my thought.

Although this thread was more directed at persons with religious beliefs, who might be against gene-engineering humans because they considered it to be against some "god's plan". I was attempting to say that, basically, how the hell do they know?
 
As long as we stick to genes that appear naturally in the human genome, and are otherwise very very careful, I don't have a problem with it.
 
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