View Poll Results: Is Global Warming a myth?

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  • Yes, explain

    52 34.44%
  • No, Explain

    99 65.56%
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Thread: Is Global Warming a myth?

  1. #681
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    You're also missing the point that the logic behind global warming is sound, regardless of imperical data up to this point.
    Sorry, but "it's logical" is not the same thing as "it's proven". Maybe someday you'll learn the difference.

    By the way, the phrase, "...regardless of the empirical data..." is not something a scientist would ever say while asserting a theory. I also suspect they would never misspell empirical...

    The logic behind AGW is a logic train, starting at increased amounts of CO2 in the atmosphere, proceeding to increased amounts of evaporation, and ending with the environment responding to the evaporation increase by increasing the temperature, or the amount of entropy in the environment.
    Yes, I've heard your theory a million god damn times. I understand your theory quite well. As soon as you can produce some solid evidence to support your theory, I'll stop laughing at your amateurish attempts to educate me on basic science.

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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    We are having record cold temperatures and snowfall in history across the United States so the question begs to be asked...
    The records were for snowfall. The frequency of storms in the middle latitudes has decreased as the climate has warmed, but the intensity of those storms has increased. Why? Hotter air can hold more moisture, so when a storm occurs it can unleash massive amounts of snow. Colder air, by contrast, is drier; if we were in a truly vicious cold snap, like the one that occurred over much of the East Coast during parts of January, we would be unlikely to see heavy snowfall.

    Any observant skier (or Eskimo) looking at all the snowfall videos for the continental US would immediately see that the snowflakes were large and wet, not small. That indicates snow nucleation at higher temperatures, not lower.

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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    1. It's a comprehensive analysis of satellite temperature data from the past thirty years.
    Up to June of 2009.

    Since then:

    "NCDC scientists also noted the average temperature for the decade (2000-09), 57.9 degrees F, was the warmest on record surpassing the 1990-99 average of 57.7 degrees F. value."
    NOAA - National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration - NOAA: December Global Ocean Temperature Second Warmest on Record
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Up to June of 2009.

    Since then:

    "NCDC scientists also noted the average temperature for the decade (2000-09), 57.9 degrees F, was the warmest on record surpassing the 1990-99 average of 57.7 degrees F. value."
    NOAA - National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration - NOAA: December Global Ocean Temperature Second Warmest on Record
    The satellite temperature data proves there has been no statistically significant warming in the past 16 years. Nothing you say will change that immutable fact. Just because 2009 was the fifth hottest year on record does not mean that the 16 year trend is somehow negated. Moreover, satellite temperature data is the most accurate and consistent measure of global temperatures; the deviation between the two data sets is extremely small. You cited oceanic temperature data, which is not nearly as comprehensive.

    Since there has been no statistically significant warming in the past 16 years, we must conclude that the AGW climate models are crap. That doesn't disprove the theory of AGW necessarily, but it certainly disproves the methodology of prominent climatologists.

    Either way, I have no hopes of convincing you of anything. You're emotionally invested in AGW being true, so no amount of evidence will convince you of anything. You've accepted the theory as gospel and will continue to push it no matter what.

    Consider yourself ignored henceforth.

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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    You're also missing the point that the logic behind global warming is sound, regardless of imperical data up to this point.
    The logic of phlogiston worked well, too.

    The efforts of people like Lavoisseur put an end to phlogiston.

    So did the logic of Aristotle and Ptolemy worked for a thousand years.

    The efforts of Copernicus, Kepler, Galileo, and Newton put and to Ptolemy.

    Facts trump theory.

    That's the heart of science.

    The facts trump AGW.

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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    That losses a lot of credibility because it is 1. on a very short time scale, when meteorlogical patterns only become apparent after decades of information, and 2. this is a projected cooling pattern, based off of a incredibly small amount of foundational data.
    As opposed to AGW's projected warming pattern based of an incredibly long train of falsified research?

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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    As opposed to AGW's projected warming pattern based of an incredibly long train of falsified research?
    Very few people question the data itself, we just question the theiry behind the cause of the change.

    To claim the data was false would be to essentially claim that the ice age is not comming to an end, and that is stupid. We simply question the theory that is being espoused as to the cause of the change.
    War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. - John Stuart Mill

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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    The satellite temperature data proves there has been no statistically significant warming in the past 16 years. Nothing you say will change that immutable fact. Just because 2009 was the fifth hottest year on record does not mean that the 16 year trend is somehow negated. Moreover, satellite temperature data is the most accurate and consistent measure of global temperatures; the deviation between the two data sets is extremely small. You cited oceanic temperature data, which is not nearly as comprehensive.

    Since there has been no statistically significant warming in the past 16 years, we must conclude that the AGW climate models are crap. That doesn't disprove the theory of AGW necessarily, but it certainly disproves the methodology of prominent climatologists.
    Your referenced study only used data up to June 2009:

    "Global satellite data is analyzed for temperature trends for the period January 1979 through June 2009."

    Whereas the NCDC study was for the entire year of 2009 compared with data dating back to 1958.

    "NCDC scientists also noted the average temperature for the decade (2000-09), 57.9 degrees F, was the warmest on record surpassing the 1990-99 average of 57.7 degrees F. value."

    NOAA - National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration - NOAA: December Global Ocean Temperature Second Warmest on Record

    You cooling theory also does not explain the continued loss of mass of the ice caps and glaciers world wide.

    "The average mass balance of the glaciers with available long-term mass balance series around the world continues to decrease, with tentative figures indicating a further thickness reduction of 1.4 m w.e. during the hydrological year 2006. This continues the trend in accelerated ice loss during the past two and a half decades and brings the total loss since 1980 at more than 10.5 m w.e."
    World Glacier Monitoring Service
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    350,000,000 Live down river of the Ganges.
    The Gangroti Glacier that is it's source, is Melting an an Increasing rate.
    What will happen in 20 years when it slows to a trickle and 30 when it dies?

    Or similary, in 20 years, when Glacier National Park, has NO Glaciers. (!)

    http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/IOTD/view.php?id=4594



    "....For instance, 150 years ago there were 147 glaciers in Glacier National Park. Today, only 37 glaciers remain, and scientists say they will likely completely melt by the year 2030.

    Similarly, glaciers all across the Alps are retreating and disappearing every year.

    What causes any given glacier to grow or shrink over time? Scientists at the United States Geological Survey (USGS), in concert with NASA and the National Snow and Ice Data Center (NSIDC), are developing a global inventory of all the world’s glaciers to help researchers track each glacier’s history. The inventory combines current information on size and movement with historical data, maps, and photos of each glacier. The purpose is to better enable scientists to correlate changes in each glacier with any shifts in local climate, such as temperature or precipitation changes. (For more information, read the feature article entitled Sizing Up the Earth’s Glaciers.)
    But it is not feasible to visit and measure every major glacier on Earth. There are almost 160,000 glaciers in Earth’s polar regions and high mountain environments. Therefore, researchers are increasingly using satellite remote sensors to routinely survey our world’s glaciers in a fraction of the time and cost it would otherwise take.

    The false-color image above shows the Gangotri Glacier, situated in the Uttarkashi District of Garhwal Himalaya. Currently 30.2 km long and between 0.5 and 2.5 km wide, Gangotri glacier is one of the largest in the Himalaya. Gangotri has been receding since 1780, although studies show its retreat quickened after 1971. (Please note that the blue contour lines drawn here to show the recession of the glacier’s terminus over time are approximate.) Over the last 25 years, Gangotri glacier has retreated more than 850 meters, with a recession of 76 meters from 1996 to 1999 alone.
    Last edited by mbig; 02-22-10 at 11:51 PM.
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by mbig View Post
    350,000,000 Live down river of the Ganges.
    The Gangroti Glacier that is it's source, is Melting at an Increasing rate.
    What will happen in 20 years when it slows to a trickle and 30 when it dies?

    Or similarly, in 20 years, when Glacier National Park, has NO Glaciers. (!)

    Retreat of the Gangotri Glacier : Image of the Day

    Assuming, of course, that the climate doesn't change again and the glaciers start growing...
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

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