View Poll Results: Is Global Warming a myth?

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  • Yes, explain

    52 34.44%
  • No, Explain

    99 65.56%
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Thread: Is Global Warming a myth?

  1. #671
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    I think these two reports considered together are very compelling for the political debate around climate change ~


    "One degree Fahrenheit might not sound like a lot, but picture the amount of energy required to raise the temperature of a cup of water that amount. Multiply that for a swimming pool. Do so again for a planet, say Earth.

    For biology and environmental studies professor Dan Perlman of Brandeis University in Waltham, that's the import of a new report citing the past decade as the globe's warmest on record, by nearly one degree.

    "That, along with all the other evidence, continues to support the idea that we're in store for something really big here," Perlman said this past week, citing his belief that man-made emissions are artificially warming the Earth. "It's like it's another few bricks in our certainty."

    The report, issued Tuesday by the National Climatic Data Center, found that the decade 2000 to 2009 had the highest average temperature dating back to the start of record-keeping in 1880.
    The decade was 0.96 degree warmer than the 129-year average, breaking the record of 0.56 degree warmer set by the '90s and continuing a trend from the '60s.

    Also, while 0.96 degree represents a significant amount of energy, Perlman said, that number is an average for the globe, with some places staying flat or cooling and others, like the polar north, spiking.

    "There are some places that are really getting hammered," he said.
    Scientists like Perlman and many others attribute most of the warming since the mid-20th century to human activities such as the release of carbon dioxide and other heat-trapping gases into the atmosphere through fossil fuel burning. They say the evidence and causal relationships are well-established.

    "How certain do you want to be?" asked Larry McKenna, a professor in Framingham State College's department of physics and earth sciences. "We're getting up to the 99 percent level."


    But scientists from other well-regarded institutions, including the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, question the amount of warming that can be tied to human sources and how much impact might be in the pipeline. They also point to natural climate cycles like El Nino occurring over decades, centuries and millenia.

    While McKenna acknowledged the impact of natural oscillations, he said climate history-preserving ice samples from the planet's polar regions show no evidence of a similar past warming cycle, making for an unprecedented trend."

    Evidence for climate change caused by man mounts - Framingham, MA - The MetroWest Daily News


    " According to the U.S. Geological Survey (USGS), the world’s volcanoes, both on land and undersea, generate about 200 million tons of carbon dioxide (CO2) annually, while our automotive and industrial activities cause some 24 billion tons of CO2 emissions every year worldwide. Despite the arguments to the contrary, the facts speak for themselves: Greenhouse gas emissions from volcanoes comprise less than one percent of those generated by today’s human endeavors.

    Human Emissions Also Dwarf Volcanoes in Carbon Dioxide Production
    Another indication that human emissions dwarf those of volcanoes is the fact that atmospheric CO2 levels, as measured by sampling stations around the world set up by the federally funded Carbon Dioxide Information Analysis Center, have gone up consistently year after year regardless of whether or not there have been major volcanic eruptions in specific years. “If it were true that individual volcanic eruptions dominated human emissions and were causing the rise in carbon dioxide concentrations, then these carbon dioxide records would be full of spikes—one for each eruption,” says Coby Beck, a journalist writing for online environmental news portal Grist.org. “Instead, such records show a smooth and regular trend.”

    Volcanoes and Greenhouse Gases - Do Volcanoes Generate More Greenhouse Gas Than Humans?
    Last edited by Catawba; 02-22-10 at 04:53 PM.
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  2. #672
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    There have been no natural changes that could cause it that have not been scientifically ruled out in this case.
    Actually, no, that's where the debate lies.

    Some persons believe there is conclusive proof that natural changes cannot account for the current climate changes. You are one of these.

    Some persons, like myself, have yet to be convinced.

    Some never will be.
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  3. #673
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    ....Why are we still debating in the thread of somebody who clearly doesn't understand what Global Warming is or how it works?
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  4. #674
    Sporadic insanity normal.


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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    ....Why are we still debating in the thread of somebody who clearly doesn't understand what Global Warming is or how it works?
    Because we never really cared about what he thought?
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Could you also cite the decrease in temperature?
    Trend Analysis of Satellite Global Temperature Data

    Global satellite data is analyzed for temperature trends for the period January 1979 through June 2009. Beginning and ending segments show a cooling trend, while the middle segment evinces a warming trend. The past 12 to 13 years show cooling using both satellite data sets, with lower confidence limits that do not exclude a negative trend until 16 years. It is shown that several published studies have predicted cooling in this time frame. One of these models is extrapolated from its 2000 calibration end date and shows a good match to the satellite data, with a projection of continued cooling for several more decades.

    NCASI Health Monitor




  6. #676
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    But complete outsiders with no knowledge on the subject are credible eh? That's the point you're trying to make? I'm still taking the scientists over opinionated, biased folk with no training in and little understanding of science.
    You're missing the point. The IPCC and GISS are not credible, which makes their theories concerning AGW illegitimate.; not to mention their climate models have been falsified by real scientists.

  7. #677
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Trend Analysis of Satellite Global Temperature Data

    Global satellite data is analyzed for temperature trends for the period January 1979 through June 2009. Beginning and ending segments show a cooling trend, while the middle segment evinces a warming trend. The past 12 to 13 years show cooling using both satellite data sets, with lower confidence limits that do not exclude a negative trend until 16 years. It is shown that several published studies have predicted cooling in this time frame. One of these models is extrapolated from its 2000 calibration end date and shows a good match to the satellite data, with a projection of continued cooling for several more decades.
    This report is outdated. Note the end date of the data analyzed - June, 2009.
    From your source:

    "Global satellite data is analyzed for temperature trends for the period January 1979 through June 2009."



    For more up to date analysis ~

    January 21, 2010

    "The global ocean surface temperature was the second warmest on record for December, according to scientists at NOAA’s National Climatic Data Center in Asheville, N.C. Based on records going back to 1880, the monthly NCDC analysis is part of the suite of climate services NOAA provides. Scientists also reported the combined global land and ocean surface temperature was the eighth warmest on record for December.

    For 2009, global temperatures tied with 2006 as the fifth-warmest on record. Also, the earth’s land surface for 2009 was seventh-warmest (tied with 2003) and the ocean surface was fourth-warmest (tied with 2002 and 2004.)

    Highlights for December 2009

    * The global ocean temperature was the second warmest on record, behind 1997. The temperature anomaly was 0.97 degree F above the 20th century average of 60.4 degrees F.
    * The combined global land and ocean surface temperature was the eighth warmest on record, at 0.88 degree F above the 20th century average of 54.0 degrees F.
    * The global land surface temperature was 0.63 degree F above the 20th century average of 38.7 degrees F - the coolest December anomaly since 2002.

    Global Temperature Highlights for 2009

    * For the calendar year 2009, the global combined land and ocean surface temperature of 58.0 degrees F tied with 2006 as the fifth-warmest on record. This value is 1.01 degree F above the 20th century average.
    * NCDC scientists also noted the average temperature for the decade (2000-09), 57.9 degrees F, was the warmest on record surpassing the 1990-99 average of 57.7 degrees F. value."

    NOAA - National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration - NOAA: December Global Ocean Temperature Second Warmest on Record
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  8. #678
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Trend Analysis of Satellite Global Temperature Data

    Global satellite data is analyzed for temperature trends for the period January 1979 through June 2009. Beginning and ending segments show a cooling trend, while the middle segment evinces a warming trend. The past 12 to 13 years show cooling using both satellite data sets, with lower confidence limits that do not exclude a negative trend until 16 years. It is shown that several published studies have predicted cooling in this time frame. One of these models is extrapolated from its 2000 calibration end date and shows a good match to the satellite data, with a projection of continued cooling for several more decades.

    NCASI Health Monitor



    That losses a lot of credibility because it is 1. on a very short time scale, when meteorlogical patterns only become apparent after decades of information, and 2. this is a projected cooling pattern, based off of a incredibly small amount of foundational data.
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  9. #679
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    You're missing the point. The IPCC and GISS are not credible, which makes their theories concerning AGW illegitimate.; not to mention their climate models have been falsified by real scientists.
    You're also missing the point that the logic behind global warming is sound, regardless of imperical data up to this point.

    The logic behind AGW is a logic train, starting at increased amounts of CO2 in the atmosphere, proceeding to increased amounts of evaporation, and ending with the environment responding to the evaporation increase by increasing the temperature, or the amount of entropy in the environment.
    Veni. Vidi. Vici.
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    The Only Thing to Fear is Fear Itself.
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    Re: Is Global Warming a myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    That losses a lot of credibility because it is 1. on a very short time scale, when meteorlogical patterns only become apparent after decades of information, and 2. this is a projected cooling pattern, based off of a incredibly small amount of foundational data.
    1. It's a comprehensive analysis of satellite temperature data from the past thirty years. Despite your insistence to the contrary, warming and cooling patterns are ascertainable within such time frames; the fact that the results do not coincide with your chosen dogma is not my problem. Either address specifically his results (don't bother, they've already been independently verified; even AGW high priest Jones admits there has been no statistically significant warming in the past fifteen years; the data confirms this beyond a doubt) or just stop embarrassing yourself by trying to dismiss peer-reviewed scientific literature.

    2. The projection is overlaid on the actual data and they coincide rather well. Furthermore, the projection is not Dr. Loehle's; it's from a separate study and the reason he overlaid the projection was to demonstrate how well their projections have coincided with actual temperature data, which shows cooling relative to 1998. If you had actually bothered to read the study in its entirety you might have noticed that little factoid.

    3. Read the study before you fashion another ill-conceived rebuttal.
    Last edited by Ethereal; 02-22-10 at 10:18 PM.

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