View Poll Results: Is there still risk of "global war"(between 2 or more of 7 large powers)

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    4 7.14%
  • No, nuclear weapons make it impossible

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  • Maybe

    13 23.21%
  • Yes

    30 53.57%
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Thread: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

  1. #81
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    Re: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    Thanks. I had to look up several terms again.

    So what is the best course of action, assuming we aren't already to far gone in the death spiral? Cut the deficit, right? But having sufficient government spending to prop up GDP helps the economy recover. Which is the better short-term vs long-term solution?
    well it is of course more complicated and nuanced but that is the simplest way I could put it, please check my work, I am no wizard that's for sure but I do understand the mechanics and a lot of stuff that is not taught in econ class !! how monetary systems work is one of those items not taught

    best course of action?

    short term: cut discretionary spending and by quite a bit and for the US that means mostly military

    enact reforms AND enforce existing law and clear out the insolvent, especially the banks, some of the old law that got undone should be brought back

    work with the states and people and make it abundantly clear what is going on and stop lying to them, keep some honest economic stats for a change too.......if things are bad then say so, don't lie about it a hide from it, lying will bite you later

    protect your people, ya it sucks but it is far easier to feed and take care of your unemployed than face a revolt and its cheaper than the alternatives in the long run

    get ready for a protratced time of basically no growth, make sure state and local govts are aware of our situation.........that way they don't over hire or make pension promises they can't keep

    kill the FED, set rates at market detrmined levels, just do it carefully and slowly, restore money management back to the govt where it Constitutionally resides anway

    work with other nations not against them, they are in this too, no need for currency and trade wars right now

    stop borrowing, if you can't afford it then don't buy it

    mid term:
    Phase out the subsidies that favor high energy industry and low labor production so people can get back to work. We are a developed post industrial economy, act like it. The govt could save huge money here. People will work hard rather than starve or take hand outs if given a reasonable chance(imagine that).

    put the nation on a crash energy diet, use incentives not increased taxes to do this

    we really need to get honest about what the govt's mandated services are vs what it can actually afford to provide as well, by like 40% or so

    break up the too big to fail, use anti-trust laws and break the monopolies up

    do all that, then start lowering some of taxes to a reasonable level as revenues fall in line with actual expenses

    long term:pray it works

    ***********************

    current path and policy:
    it mirrors Japan except we are a net importer, but covering up debt with funny money and pumping up govt spending won't work, we can't borrow that much and for long enough nor does it fix what ails us

    Like Hoover Obama is pretending the fraudulent and corrupt have changed and they haven't. They have dug in and latched onto the govt money spigot. This won't end well.

    I could go on but all it would do is piss me off

  2. #82
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    Re: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

    Quote Originally Posted by elbatrop View Post
    short term: cut discretionary spending and by quite a bit and for the US that means mostly military
    It does?

    The FIRST step in determing what is acceptable discretionary spending is found in the US Constitution.

    No social entitlement program fits inside Article 1, Section 8, ergo, those programs should be ceased forthwith.

    Oops, that's an over 60% hack in the budget immediately.

    Some military expenditures are wasteful, unnecessary, and probably unconstitutional, such as our defense of Europe.

    But, that bit about China, Russia, et al, hacking our cyber systems and in general presenting a clear and present danger cannot be ignored. National Defense is the #1 Constitutional priority of the Federal Government.

  3. #83
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    Re: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    It does?

    The FIRST step in determing what is acceptable discretionary spending is found in the US Constitution.

    No social entitlement program fits inside Article 1, Section 8, ergo, those programs should be ceased forthwith.

    Oops, that's an over 60% hack in the budget immediately.

    Some military expenditures are wasteful, unnecessary, and probably unconstitutional, such as our defense of Europe.

    But, that bit about China, Russia, et al, hacking our cyber systems and in general presenting a clear and present danger cannot be ignored. National Defense is the #1 Constitutional priority of the Federal Government.
    Ya, go ahead and cut 150 million people off from their income, and do it all at once, don't complain when you don't get the result you think you will. Besides the US is already honor bound to keep much of he entitlement stuff going for another couple decades, wanna phase it out after that though that process could be started. It is responsible for the promises already made.

    Yes defense or in the case if the US offense could be cut way way back and still stay nice and safe and sound at home, that too would have to be done slowly but we aren't locked into long term stuff with it. Iraq and Afghanistan alone will have back end costs for at least a decade if the US left right now.

    Defense as far as cyber security is not big or expensive, and US military servers got hacked and offloaded already, of course Clinton and Bush never said anything but it but it happened to both of them. Defense of the nation itself also doesn't have to be expensive, far cheaper than maintaining an empire that will have to be ended sooner or later because it is unaffordable. Yes the Constitution requires defense, it does NOT however mean bankrupting yourself and still being unable to defend yourself which the US military is unable to do anyway. It is ill suited to most threats this nation faces. Defense is also much more than just hardware and men, if you can't support it financially and with resources you waste your time. It is only mandated to defend the homeland, nothing more, nothing less. It isn't even set up for it.

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    Re: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

    Quote Originally Posted by elbatrop View Post
    kill the FED, set rates at market detrmined levels, just do it carefully and slowly, restore money management back to the govt where it Constitutionally resides anway
    Could you talk about what you mean with this one a bit more? How is the FED bad? Are you talking stopping monetary policy and going solely with kensyian?

    we really need to get honest about what the govt's mandated services are vs what it can actually afford to provide as well, by like 40% or so
    The thing that gets me is that we used to spend a much higher percentage of our government spending on defense and security. The introduction of entitlements, followed by the "unexpected" growth due to longer lifespans, sucks up a growing percentage of our spending and it is mandatory, so defense is the one on the chopping block. We need to finish our overseas commitments. And to think they have been trying to introduce MORE entitlements with health care reform. They ought to go ahead and ax SS, we know its coming.

    I could go on but all it would do is piss me off
    Thanks for the info. It was new to me - I haven't been paying attention. Don't get pissed off!

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    Re: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

    Global War is already happening, but they are called "Proxy Wars".

    Does it matter if the Iranian Revolutionary Guard actually boxes up and ships to Afghanistan to fight against Americans? They send supplies and resources to fighters in Afghanistan.
    "I do not underestimate the ability of fanatical groups of terrorists to kill and destroy, but they do not threaten the life of the nation. Whether we would survive Hitler hung in the balance, but there is no doubt that we shall survive al-Qa'ida." -- Lord Hoffmann

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    Re: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    Could you talk about what you mean with this one a bit more? How is the FED bad? Are you talking stopping monetary policy and going solely with kensyian?



    The thing that gets me is that we used to spend a much higher percentage of our government spending on defense and security. The introduction of entitlements, followed by the "unexpected" growth due to longer lifespans, sucks up a growing percentage of our spending and it is mandatory, so defense is the one on the chopping block. We need to finish our overseas commitments. And to think they have been trying to introduce MORE entitlements with health care reform. They ought to go ahead and ax SS, we know its coming.



    Thanks for the info. It was new to me - I haven't been paying attention. Don't get pissed off!
    The FED is a private cartel of banks, it is fully independent of the government and is not a government agency and the money the Treasury prints for it known as "Federal Reserve" notes is NOT US GOVT MONEY, it enjoys backing of the govt but isn't govt money. The IRS is their enforcement squad at least a part of it. Originally when the FED law ws passed on Christmas eve 1913 which was followed by the IRS taxes were basically to pay the FED back for paying the Treasury to print Fed Resrve notes. Didn't take long for that to get perverted.

    The FED is made up of 12 member or charter banks if you will, they bought into the system and pay a 6% fee to the FED system yearly on the Federal Reserve stock they bought in with. For that fee they recieve lots of perks like being able to issue money to non FED banks which they get paid interest, borrow money at zero interest or ultra low rates. They are also in charge of some of the regulation of the other banks as well as themselves. They set the lending rate between banks for overnight loans. There is a whole section of US Title 12 that describes all the regs and laws they have to follow, some of which they flat out do not follow or enforce, part of the reason how this crisis happened. The FED is our money control outsourced basically and it is the most profitable and protected money making machine scheme ever. The ownership of the FED system has never really been disclosed but it does include foreign interests, can you say security risk? I think you can. It repatriates its "profits" after expenses to the Treasury each year but if you look at their activities and balance sheet what of it is revealed anyway and its a joke.

    The FED's mission statement is to maintain economic growth, full employment, and stabilize interest rates. They have failed and many times. Its actions have for the most part made the cycles of business and the economy be more severe than they would have been if left on their own.

    Our Constitution already established standards for our money, which btw includes that paper can be redeemed for gold. The founding fathers knew how money and power could be abused, they weren't stupid. The FED is for all practical purposes is a parasite that skims money off of everyone's work and enjoys a situation where it never gets auditied, answers to nobody, and makes a killing in good or bad times. Despite its claims it is also quite political.

    As far as th budget, well the offical military budget is now about $700 billion, but that's just a part. The rest is off budget or buried in the rest of the budget. The CIA budget is never released. In reality the govt spends a little over a trillion per year on it plus back end expenses. Yep, that is about 50% of the budget. Always remember the govt lies about its finances and economic stats, ALWAYS. Nothing is what it appears on the surface.

    For example, the unemployment stat they use nowadays is U-3, its about 10.3%, U-6 is 17.x%, unemployment using Depression era counting is well over 25% !! Back then unemployed was anyone without a job over the age of 16. Same with the inflation stats, they are adjusted to look better and cut their entitelment spending by staying behind the actual inflation rate, meaning if you are on a fixed income you are slowly sinking. All the stats are gamed and massaged.

  7. #87
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    Re: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    If China makes a serious push to take over Siberia, a war could result that could go nuclear. If Russia decides to reignite the Cold War and reassert its control over Eastern Europe by turning off the gas, tensions between the US and Russia would increase dramatically and might eventually result in a global war. But I don't think it's likely to happen. China will probably come to own Siberia through relatively peaceful means, and Russia won't be able to exert its influence over Eastern Europe for much longer.
    What? Now that is an absurd scenario. China trying to "take" a piece of land from a nuclear power. Hardly. First of all, Russia is a big nuclear power. Secondly. China is having a "peaceful rice" , thirdly they wouldnt be so stupid.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    The world is not going to run out of resources anytime soon. That's just silly, and shows a lack of understanding for how economics and/or technological progress works.
    I mean, not only resources, but we are heading for a large range of global disasters, and the only ones tryging to change their way of living is for the most of it Europe. China is growing up and probably will also take a lead in that area and create eventually a whole new type of sustainable society, while Europe will struggle but make it possible, and America refuse to change, and fail.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post

    Are you really 25? Because you sound like you're about 14.
    What an adult way of debating.




    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I haven't heard of any European or Chinese politicians of any stature who share your "THE WORLD IS DOOMED RUN FOR YOUR LIVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11" mentality. Could it be that you just made that up, in yet another lame attempt to bash the United States?
    Nah, I never said that. You read terror out of fear.

    I am saying, the WORLD MUST CHANGE, or else we will just dig ourself deeper into a global disaster. Europe for one is trying to avoid this, and is already well on their way to building a more sustainable society with a less disasterous effect of our living. While China is progressing so fast and in a modern time where its easy to just build keepinig those things in mind. The US on the other hand is doing nothing, just defending capitalism, nationalism, selfishness and greed as good values. Which might make the global disaster only regional to the Americas, parts of Asia and perhaps parts of Africa, instead of the whole world. But that depends on Europe actually having the guts to go through a difficult reformation, and China actually living up to its vast potential.


    Quote Originally Posted by creativedreams View Post
    A Russian General has stated his wanting of Russia to join with China and other countries to for a Globally Geographically Strategic Alliance.

    He said that Total War is the only way to stop the U.S. from it's influence on all of Mankind.

    I have always predicted a blindsided attack on the U.S. by China for many reasons, in the future, and now I believe it will be a joint attack by China/Russia when they have lulled the U.S. to feel secure.

    That same Russian General has publicly stated his belief that the U.S. Government's story for 9/11 is a fairytale and it was a staged event to change U.S. policies.
    Hmm.. Russian generals say a lot of things. But I think this would not be a good strategy.
    A good strategy for Russia for example would be weakening the US by supporting terror states and terrorist attacks on the US, to treble them into becoming even more of a fascist police state. Once the US has totally transformed from an open society to a closed one, Russia has won, especially considering they are transforming from a closed society to an open one.

    China will not attack the US(I believe) they will just kick it when its down to further weaken it. But not by war or violence, just in diplomatic and economic ways.
    Last edited by Maximus Zeebra; 01-25-10 at 06:06 AM.
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

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    Re: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav View Post
    It was the biggest single attack on the U.S., well, ever. Not exactly "relatively small".

    We went to war because of Pearl Harbor, and less people died there than on 9/11.


    Maybe its time you people get the f*** over that. Its a tiny attack, there are 6 billion people on this earth, 3000 people died. So ****ing what. 16000 children die from starvation every day. Learn to put things into perspective man before resorting to nationalist arguments.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dav View Post
    I'm done here; I feel no need to argue with conspiracy theorists.
    Its people like you who unknowingly support facist regimes(US republicans) with ignorance.

    Realize it already. Your country has changed from the most open society in the world to a semi closed society. You lost the war on terror before it even started.


    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener View Post


    Are you sure it wasn't this fellow who told you that?


    Nah, this fellow told me it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Coronado View Post
    China and Russia don't get along, and they never have. Even a casual observer of history knows this.

    Unless that is part of some sort of super-secret conspiracy only you know of ...
    China and Russia have military cooperation at very high levels. Not even a secret that China buys Russian technology and that they have had big military drills together. You can even find it in the censored US mainstream media.
    Last edited by Maximus Zeebra; 01-25-10 at 06:19 AM.
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

  9. #89
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    Re: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Partisan View Post
    We should drop a bomb on Mecca, maybe it will ease our paranoia.......
    drop a bomb on washington and ease the rest of the worlds

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    Re: Do you believe in the possibility of a new global war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Wait a second. So you're saying China views the US as a declining power...and therefore they're going to ally with RUSSIA?! Russia is the most obviously declining power in the world, much moreso than the US.
    Delusional. Russia is growing again. US is in a long term collapse, that is reality. Also US is becoming a closed society while Russia is becoming an open society.

    So, you are wrong. Also your defintion of "power" is wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    There is a much bigger risk of war between Russia and China, than between either of them and the US. You're right that China wants energy, but it has its eye on Siberia for precisely that reason. For now, China is content to trade with Russia (with terms favorable to China). But in a couple decades when China is much stronger and Russia is much weaker, China might decide that it wants Siberia for itself. The region is already becoming ethnically and linguistically Chinese.
    Where to you get this concpiracy stuff from?


    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    The United States is one of the safest sovereign debts on the planet (the 7th safest as of Q4 2009).


    Yes, on paper and in their own propaganda. Nazi Germany was probably also pretty safe to borrow to in 1940-1942.


    Quote Originally Posted by elbatrop View Post
    the US is a declining power, has been for quite awhile, but China isn't allyng with Russia for defensive reasons other than having reliable oil supply is defensive in its own right and Russia is the #1 or #2 world oil producer and has been for a couple years now. The US on the otherhand refuses to pay its debts, conducts its finances like a criminal, and is a net oil importer with waning supply sources. China isn't stupid they see this too.

    The United States unless it very very abruptly changes its ways or the rest of the world falls apart entirely will more than likley default, it is economically screwed. It is making the same mistakes most empires do including Russia, Great Britain, and even Rome. You might wanna take a look at what quantitative easing is and really means, round two will be coming shortly. Ponzi scheme economics doesn't last very long.
    Thanks for saying what I would say.

    So who will jail them and why is the US military budget increasing at record speeds?

    Quote Originally Posted by elbatrop View Post
    Well nations tend to go to war when they get antsy for resources and have large militaries to use rather than do things in a more honorable and forthright fashion. Having a large military and using it constantly means having vast resources to use to begin with.

    many wars have been fought over resources, and resources are going to get very very tight, many nations will be forced to go without, many will fight rather than adapt or change

    one of these days the little proxy wars and skirmishes will turn into something more serious, I think it is very likely it will happen at some stage soon
    How would the US react if Russia invaded Iraq with Iran helping them?

    Quote Originally Posted by elbatrop View Post
    some nations even resort to lying and fabricating justification over it, as a general rule man isn't too smart collectively

    NAZI Germany was experts at this!!!

    Many people, even a global genious such as George Soros, compare the methods of the US with those of NAZI Germany(and he lived in fear from them). So have I done for a long time.

    (DISCLAIMER)
    To Republicans:
    NOT SAYING HERE THAT THE US IS SOCIALIST.
    Last edited by Maximus Zeebra; 01-25-10 at 06:33 AM.
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

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